Tiger Woods vs. Kerri Strug

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Appa23 · #1 Post by **Appa23** » Tue Jun 17, 2008 7:23 am

Here is one blogger who thinks that the media has overblown the story of Tiger playing golf with a knee that isn't 100%.

http://www.east-coast-bias.com/2008/06/ ... s-all.html

silverscreenselect · #2 Post by **silverscreenselect** » Tue Jun 17, 2008 9:21 am

Another mindless blog post from some idiot who's never played sports at a competitive level.

If your knee is hurting, it can affect your swing, and all it takes is a slight bit of distraction to have your shot wind up in a very bad spot on a US Open course. Plus, one of Tiger's great strengths is his distance and if he can't hit it as far, he's not as effective.

This was a remarkable performance by someone who quite well could be the greatest individual sport (as opposed to team sport) athlete of all time.

starfish1113 · #3 Post by **starfish1113** » Tue Jun 17, 2008 9:28 am

I've been finding myself agreeing with SSS quite a lot lately. This is no exception. Regardless of what you think of Tiger (and I'm surprised at all the animosity I've heard regarding him in the recent past), his performance this past weekend will stand the test of time. He wasn't faking his injury and he hadn't played a competitive round of golf since The Masters (I think that was his last time). I am very happy that the entire family had a chance to watch Sunday's round (and we are a Tiger family, so there was much cheering going on). Sarah (9) sat in front of the TV from beginning to end, and I'm confident that she will remember it forever.

Appa23 · #4 Post by **Appa23** » Tue Jun 17, 2008 10:36 am

The part that no one will ever know (at least the full facts) is just how injured the knee is.

I did find Tiger's press conference yesterday to be interesting, as he showed some signs that he also was tired of the "how heroic and gutsy" he was for playing with a bad knee. As Tiger said, "It is just what you do when you play sports. You play with nagging injuries." I also was glad to see that he noted that Rocco Mediate's back issues have been much worse than his knee issue.

In my mind, Tiger's performance does not quite reach the level of Sandy Koufax or Ben Hogan, but I do put it above Kirk Gibson (who only had to hit one white ball on a bad leg). Still, to me, the most amazing part was that Tiger could win a major championship after playing only 27 holes of practice this week at Torrey Pines, very few other holes of live golf, and limited range practice. (As noted by Fishie)

It also brings to mind a much more amazing example of "determination over pain" that I witnessed several weeks back. I have noted in previous posts that our dance studio's owners have a 15 year-old daughter who is quite a good dancer. About a week before the last competition, she went to see a sports doctor about some debilitating pain that she starting feeling in her right knee after a high school dance team practice. The doctor advised her that she had some damage that needed to be scoped/cleared and that she needed to stay off the leg for the next month. Well, she did not want to let down her friends/teammates, nor did she want to make everyone learn new choreography to cover her absence (as she is a focal point in several dances).

As I worked back stage as a "roadie", I watched her use crutches all of the way to the curtains area, place the crutches against the wall, and then dance with a smile on her face the entire time. As soon as she left the judges eyesight, she immediately was back on the crutches, in obvious pain. Over the course of 2 days, she performed no less than 10 dances requiring her to leap, spin, tap, and kick on a very bad leg.

Then, she shut it down and listened to the doctor (until recital). Tiger has nothing on this petite teen.

JBillyGirl · #5 Post by **JBillyGirl** » Tue Jun 17, 2008 11:01 am

One of the responses to the blog entry mentioned a Japanese gymnast (named Shun Fujimoto) who did his final two routines in the 1976 Olympic team competition with a broken leg. The last of these was on the rings, which included an 8-ft drop to the floor on the dismount. His gutsy performance helped his team upset the Soviets for the team gold medal and made him a national hero, but interestingly he says he would not do it again. (His knee still gives him trouble.)

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/events ... hback.html

I admit I was rooting for Rocco Mediate yesterday, because Tiger seems to win everything and the win would have meant more to his opponent. However, I've got to give Woods serious props for pulling through while injured.

Appa23 · #6 Post by **Appa23** » Tue Jun 17, 2008 11:04 am

Yes, that Japanese gymnast is included in this list of athletes who won while injured.

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/st ... eld/080616

peacock2121 · #7 Post by **peacock2121** » Tue Jun 17, 2008 12:23 pm

Tiger is mentally tough.

For him, it is just pain.

I admire that in him.

MarleysGh0st · #8 Post by **MarleysGh0st** » Tue Jun 17, 2008 12:43 pm

Yikes!

Appa, tell me you didn't that that tornado picture, yourself!

mellytu74 · #9 Post by **mellytu74** » Tue Jun 17, 2008 9:33 pm

Gee, Tiger Woods won.

Sun set in the west tonight?

I am no pooh-poohing his play over the weekend. It was marvelous. It was a fine, fine tournament. Coming back from his injury to play was amazing.

But, just once, I would love it if an underdog beat Tiger on the back nine some Sunday, or in a playoff the next day.

kayrharris · #10 Post by **kayrharris** » Tue Jun 17, 2008 9:38 pm

You and me both, Mel.

Glad I'm not alone.

#11 Post by **tubadave** » Tue Jun 17, 2008 10:10 pm

Appa23 wrote:Still, to me, the most amazing part was that Tiger could win a major championship after playing only 27 holes of practice this week at Torrey Pines, very few other holes of live golf, and limited range practice. (As noted by Fishie)

To expand on that a bit.....after having his knee scoped, he took two months off from all competitive golf and didn't even walk 18 holes in a row again until the first round last Thursday. And then he had to play 91 holes over five days. And he still beat everyone in a tournament that featured virtually all of the best players in the world.

Absolutely incredible.

I root for Tiger everytime he's on the course, and I always have. Besides the fact that I guess I feel connected to him because we're nearly the same age (about six weeks difference, I believe) I also really want to see a great talent like him go on to win 20+ majors and leave absolutely no room for argument about whether there's ever been anyone better.

peacock2121 · #12 Post by **peacock2121** » Wed Jun 18, 2008 3:36 am

This is meant as no disrespect to Tiger fans.

Here is what I came to:

It is easy being a Tiger fan.

It is hard being a Baby Boy fan.

I don't mind hard.

Estonut · #13 Post by **Estonut** » Wed Jun 18, 2008 3:51 am

Appa23 wrote:In my mind, Tiger's performance does not quite reach the level of Sandy Koufax or Ben Hogan, but I do put it above Kirk Gibson (who only had to hit one white ball on a bad leg).

You've got to be kidding. Gibson wasn't playing tee-ball. I seem to recall that the "one white ball" he had to hit was pitched to him by a Hall of Fame pitcher. I think he had 2 bad legs and could barely walk to the plate. If he hits it into fair territory anywhere but over the fence, the Dodgers lose the game, and probably the Series. Gibson had a single shot to get it right. How many chances did Tiger have to hit the ball?

kusch · #14 Post by **kusch** » Wed Jun 18, 2008 6:02 am

peacock2121 wrote:Tiger is mentally tough.

For him, it is just pain.

I admire that in him.

I know we hear the "mentally tough" a lot, not only with Tiger, but others.

What does it really mean? How do we really know what is mentally going on with another person?

The ad with Tiger and his Dad talking about making Tiger "mentally tough" is a nice ad, but just because Dad said so does not make it so.

Tiger just flat out has "game". He would be #1 all time on my list of golfers. Period.

peacock2121 · #15 Post by **peacock2121** » Wed Jun 18, 2008 6:41 am

kusch wrote:
peacock2121 wrote:Tiger is mentally tough.

For him, it is just pain.

I admire that in him.
I know we hear the "mentally tough" a lot, not only with Tiger, but others.

What does it really mean? How do we really know what is mentally going on with another person?

The ad with Tiger and his Dad talking about making Tiger "mentally tough" is a nice ad, but just because Dad said so does not make it so.

Tiger just flat out has "game". He would be #1 all time on my list of golfers. Period.

Here's what it means when I say it:

- He gives no indication of 'folding' under any circumstances. I watch others (including Baby Boy) fold. Folding is mental. Folding is getting discouraged and an observer can see that happening. Folding is not being able to produce results one is able to produce when the pressure is not on - when circumstances are not shoving into you. Tiger is the best I have seen, ever, at that.

- He can stop a swing in mid-air. Holy crappola Batman. Not only can he do that, he can come back from that - regroup - and not have whatever had him stop his swing be brought into the next swing. That is being mentally tough. Having each shot be a new shot - not bringning the last one into this one. That is being mentally tough.

- How he could not have the fear of the pain his knee just might give him at any moment affect his swing and what his body would do is mental toughness. That blew my mind. I watched the slow-motion they did of his swing. That he did not stop short of turning that knee is amazing.

He is an amazing golfer.

He is not Baby Boy.

kusch · #16 Post by **kusch** » Wed Jun 18, 2008 7:25 am

peacock2121 wrote:
kusch wrote:
peacock2121 wrote:Tiger is mentally tough.

For him, it is just pain.

I admire that in him.
I know we hear the "mentally tough" a lot, not only with Tiger, but others.

What does it really mean? How do we really know what is mentally going on with another person?

The ad with Tiger and his Dad talking about making Tiger "mentally tough" is a nice ad, but just because Dad said so does not make it so.

Tiger just flat out has "game". He would be #1 all time on my list of golfers. Period.
Here's what it means when I say it:

- He gives no indication of 'folding' under any circumstances. I watch others (including Baby Boy) fold. Folding is mental. Folding is getting discouraged and an observer can see that happening. Folding is not being able to produce results one is able to produce when the pressure is not on - when circumstances are not shoving into you. Tiger is the best I have seen, ever, at that.

- He can stop a swing in mid-air. Holy crappola Batman. Not only can he do that, he can come back from that - regroup - and not have whatever had him stop his swing be brought into the next swing. That is being mentally tough. Having each shot be a new shot - not bringning the last one into this one. That is being mentally tough.

- How he could not have the fear of the pain his knee just might give him at any moment affect his swing and what his body would do is mental toughness. That blew my mind. I watched the slow-motion they did of his swing. That he did not stop short of turning that knee is amazing.

He is an amazing golfer.

He is not Baby Boy.

I like your "Folding is not being able to produce results one is able to produce when the pressure is not on" much better than "Folding is mental". But, I hear what you are saying. I can see not thinking correctly or whatever in a situation may lead to a non good result, but it still takes a physical activity to produce a desired result, good or bad.

silverscreenselect · #17 Post by **silverscreenselect** » Thu Jun 19, 2008 1:59 am

It's now revealed that Woods played with a torn ACL and a broken leg. The ACL injury isn't new; he's had it since last summer and won the PGA Championship playing through it. He tried to have the ACL remedied through arthospcopic surgery after the Masters, but it obviously didn't work that well. The broken leg occurred while Woods was trying to get ready for The Memorial two weeks earlier. Doctors recommended he stay on crutches for three weeks and rest another three but he went against their wishes.

Now he will be out the rest of the calendar year at least.

http://tinyurl.com/4ucfhu

On the one hand, what he did was questionable medically, risking his entire career to play through these injuries this last year. But it makes his accomplishments this last year, and especially this last week, all the more remarkable.

As for Kirk Gibson, his pinch hitting appearance was a calculated gamble by LaSorda. Gibson could easily have drawn a walk, which would have brought the tying run to second with Steve Sax up, or he might have been able to leg out a long hit that stayed in the park (which would have easily tied the game). Of course, we'll never know. And of course, none of that takes away from Gibson's accomplishment. However, what Tiger did wasn't one brief moment or one gymnastics routine. It was 91 grueling holes of golf against the best players in the world in sweltering conditions over five days.

I have to admit I was pulling for Mediate, because that's pretty much going to be his one shot at a moment like this (a number of Tiger's memorable wins have come against guys having the tournament of their lives). But the more I learn about what Tiger did, the more amazing it becomes.