School's closed. Again

[mrkelley23]

Y'all in the frozen north would laugh your guts out at us. There's barely a dusting on the ground right now, and we're forecast to get maybe three inches.

We've already missed five days, and this will make our sixth.

Unfortunately, we've got a new superintendent, and he got burned the first time we had snow, because he DIDN'T cancel or delay, and things got nightmarish (glare ice) at exactly the wrong time, so people were hotting and hollering for days afterward. We've now become like those districts in Kentucky we always used to make fun of: canceling school on a forecast.

[peacock2121]

How many 'snow days' do you have set aside?

Will this cause your spring break to be shortened?

[mrkelley23]

We had 4 set aside, so something's going to have to happen. We have petitioned the state to "forgive" the other days, but that almost never happens.

Most likely we will be in school on Friday Mar. 21, which was scheduled to be a vacation day, but not a makeup day. After that is anyone's guess.

But these snow days hit us in the budget, as well. Part of Indiana's payments to schools is predicated on attendance rates. Needless to say, if we have school on the 21st, the attendance rates will not be very high.

[peacock2121]

My sister's scholl has also used one more snow day than they had 'in the budget'. When they cut spring break short, they also run into not meeting the attendance mark.

What happens when the state doesn't provide the state aid? Is the school budget then tapped into?

[mrkelley23]

Most school systems have a "rainy day fund" that they can tap into for emergencies. Our system has not been real good at keeping that, but they recently announced that they had been able to get a couple million dollars into that fund, so if we wind up net negative, that's probably where it will come from.

What bugs me the most is that in situations like this, where the school system is NOT at fault, if the money isn't paid out, it's rolled back into the state's general fund, thereby making the legislators look better.

I think if the state DOE doesn't grant exceptions for snow days, it should least allow the systems to not count the makeup days as attendance days.

[Appa23]

What's "hotting"?

[mrkelley23]

What's "hotting"?

Oh, sure, make fun of me for typoing, but Pea's "scholl" is perfectly fine, right?

I think you're just scared of her....

[Appa23]

MrK, I am not sure if I am understanding one of your points. Are you saying that if a school (school district) does not meet the required number of hours/days of education, because it invoked too many weather days, then the State Dept of Education should say, "Well, close enough"?

Such a loosening of the rules does not seem to be a step forward in improving the education of children.

It is really that big of a deal to add one more day to the end of the school year? Better yet, why wouldn't the school district just plan for more days/hours of education than is the minimum by the DOE, so that it is less of a big deal if there is an extra day off because of wetaher or mechanical failure?

[Appa23]

What's "hotting"?

Oh, sure, make fun of me for typoing, but Pea's "scholl" is perfectly fine, right?

Hey, I got picked on for "hosue" yesterday.

I think you're just scared of her....

Didn't see her typo.

I actually read your post.

[mrkelley23]

MrK, I am not sure if I am understanding one of your points. Are you saying that if a school (school district) does not meet the required number of hours/days of education, because it invoked too many weather days, then the State Dept of Education should say, "Well, close enough"?

Such a loosening of the rules does not seem to be a step forward in improving the education of children.

It is really that big of a deal to add one more day to the end of the school year? Better yet, why wouldn't the school district just plan for more days/hours of education than is the minimum by the DOE, so that it is less of a big deal if there is an extra day off because of wetaher or mechanical failure?

I am saying it would be preferable to most of the alternatives I've seen. For instance, if we tack on days to the end of school, when commencement is already fixed, we lose all our seniors for that day. Does that help their education? There is something wrong with just about every plan I've seen floated, for these types of reasons.

To answer your last question, the school system does attempt to plan for such occurrences. This particular year, we had four make-up days built into the schedule, so that if we have inclement weather, we have fallbacks. So far, though, we have had 6 "snow days" (quotes because I would've only called school off for only 3 or 4 of them). And the district does not add extra education days to the calendar, because they do not want to incur the extra personnel costs it would take. And I'm pretty sure the taxpayers here would agree with that notion, if they understood that they would have to pay more for it.

[mrkelley23]

Also, if I'm reading your post correctly, it's not what I was saying. I"m saying that if a system has to tack on days to the calendar because of weather, those days should be exempted from the attendance counts which help determine the funding from the state. That is one of the criteria which figures in to whether we are a successful school or not, but if, as you suggest, we tack on days to the end of school, we will have a maximum of 75% attendance, which will cost the district money.

[Appa23]

MrK, I am not sure if I am understanding one of your points. Are you saying that if a school (school district) does not meet the required number of hours/days of education, because it invoked too many weather days, then the State Dept of Education should say, "Well, close enough"?

Such a loosening of the rules does not seem to be a step forward in improving the education of children.

It is really that big of a deal to add one more day to the end of the school year? Better yet, why wouldn't the school district just plan for more days/hours of education than is the minimum by the DOE, so that it is less of a big deal if there is an extra day off because of wetaher or mechanical failure?

To answer your last question, the school system does attempt to plan for such occurrences. This particular year, we had four make-up days built into the schedule, so that if we have inclement weather, we have fallbacks. So far, though, we have had 6 "snow days" (quotes because I would've only called school off for only 3 or 4 of them). And the district does not add extra education days to the calendar, because they do not want to incur the extra personnel costs it would take. And I'm pretty sure the taxpayers here would agree with that notion, if they understood that they would have to pay more for it.

I was not sure that you understood my point, but it appear that you did by what you put at the end.

I will admit that I come at this issue from a different background and perspective. I am not a big fan of just doing "the minimum" with nearly anything in life. My grade school and high school did plan for many more hours of education than was required, as the minimum, by the State of Nebraska. I can not speak for all parents, but I think that I understand many of thier thoughts on the matter. They would happy if the school year or school day was longer. It seems that several view school as a cheaper "child care" alternative. Each day in June that little Johnny is at school is one day less that they have to pay for him to go to a Kindercare or a YMCA day camp.

[Appa23]

Also, if I'm reading your post correctly, it's not what I was saying. I"m saying that if a system has to tack on days to the calendar because of weather, those days should be exempted from the attendance counts which help determine the funding from the state. That is one of the criteria which figures in to whether we are a successful school or not, but if, as you suggest, we tack on days to the end of school, we will have a maximum of 75% attendance, which will cost the district money.

Why would you only have 75% attendance? Are parents really that apathetic about their children's education? When your kid is supposed to be in school, then he is supposed to be in school. Work vacations around your kids' school schedules, not vice versa. (I can see some leeway if your family vacation has some educational value, like you were going to DC or would be doing something of merit in New York, Boston, or Chicago, for example.)

YMMV

[Bixby17]

Also, if I'm reading your post correctly, it's not what I was saying. I"m saying that if a system has to tack on days to the calendar because of weather, those days should be exempted from the attendance counts which help determine the funding from the state. That is one of the criteria which figures in to whether we are a successful school or not, but if, as you suggest, we tack on days to the end of school, we will have a maximum of 75% attendance, which will cost the district money.

Why would you only have 75% attendance? Are parents really that apathetic about their children's education? When your kid is supposed to be in school, then he is supposed to be in school. Work vacations around your kids' school schedules, not vice versa. (I can see some leeway if yur family vacation has some educational value, like you were going to DC or would be doing something of merit in New York, Boston, or Chicago, for example.)

Yeah whatever.

When people make vacation plans, they tend to do it in advance. Missing a day or two of school, even if a vacation isn't specifically an educational one doesn't show that a person is apathetic, it probably shows that they don't want to cancel an expensive plane ticket.

Oh, and goofy vacations can be educational too.

[peacock2121]

What's "hotting"?

Oh, sure, make fun of me for typoing, but Pea's "scholl" is perfectly fine, right?

Hey, I got picked on for "hosue" yesterday.

I think you're just scared of her....

Didn't see her typo.

I actually read your post.

This made me laugh and laugh.

[mrkelley23]

Also, if I'm reading your post correctly, it's not what I was saying. I"m saying that if a system has to tack on days to the calendar because of weather, those days should be exempted from the attendance counts which help determine the funding from the state. That is one of the criteria which figures in to whether we are a successful school or not, but if, as you suggest, we tack on days to the end of school, we will have a maximum of 75% attendance, which will cost the district money.

Why would you only have 75% attendance? Are parents really that apathetic about their children's education? When your kid is supposed to be in school, then he is supposed to be in school. Work vacations around your kids' school schedules, not vice versa. (I can see some leeway if your family vacation has some educational value, like you were going to DC or would be doing something of merit in New York, Boston, or Chicago, for example.)

YMMV

Let me repeat it one more time. If you have a school day that follows Commencement, after the seniors' grades have been finalized and their diplomas have been printed, they will not show up. Honestly, in any mixed class, we would not want them to, because they would be a distraction. If one fourth of your school is missing, then you have a maximum of 75% attendance.

Family vacations have, obviously, already been worked around the schedule. If you change that schedule without much warning, most parents (I realize that you are an exception to this rule) are not going to cancel their cruises, plane tickets, etc., just because of an extra day being added.

Do me a favor. The next time Omaha is in this situation, with extra days having to be added to the calendar, attend whatever school any of your kids is currently going to. I'm sure it won't be a problem for you to take a day off work, because education is just that important to you. Note the attendance rate. Note the lesson plans (you will never see so many "parties," if elementary school, or videos, if high school).

I say this from experience both from my public school and my brother's kids' private schools.

And my school system (the one I attended, which happens to be the same one I currently teach in) also had more days built into the schedule than the state required, but when the state upped its requirements, the district didn't have enough money to add yet more days to its calendar. So now they match.

[peacock2121]

Also, if I'm reading your post correctly, it's not what I was saying. I"m saying that if a system has to tack on days to the calendar because of weather, those days should be exempted from the attendance counts which help determine the funding from the state. That is one of the criteria which figures in to whether we are a successful school or not, but if, as you suggest, we tack on days to the end of school, we will have a maximum of 75% attendance, which will cost the district money.

Why would you only have 75% attendance? Are parents really that apathetic about their children's education? When your kid is supposed to be in school, then he is supposed to be in school. Work vacations around your kids' school schedules, not vice versa. (I can see some leeway if your family vacation has some educational value, like you were going to DC or would be doing something of merit in New York, Boston, or Chicago, for example.)

YMMV

Let me repeat it one more time.

Do me a favor. The next time Omaha is in this situation, with extra days having to be added to the calendar, attend whatever school any of your kids is currently going to. I'm sure it won't be a problem for you to take a day off work, because education is just that important to you.

This made me laugh and laugh.

[ne1410s]

My sister's children went to school in New London, IA. If they had a snow day over and above the five built in, they went to school on Saturday.

[mrkelley23]

My sister's children went to school in New London, IA. If they had a snow day over and above the five built in, they went to school on Saturday.

That's a possibility here, too. Presumably, the school board will vote on Monday as to what they want to do. I honestly think the Saturday option would get us the best attendance, actually.

[MarleysGh0st]

And my school system (the one I attended, which happens to be the same one I currently teach in)

That's cool. So we should call you mrkotter?

[earendel]

Y'all in the frozen north would laugh your guts out at us. There's barely a dusting on the ground right now, and we're forecast to get maybe three inches.

We've already missed five days, and this will make our sixth.

Unfortunately, we've got a new superintendent, and he got burned the first time we had snow, because he DIDN'T cancel or delay, and things got nightmarish (glare ice) at exactly the wrong time, so people were hotting and hollering for days afterward. We've now become like those districts in Kentucky we always used to make fun of: canceling school on a forecast.

Our schools are closed - but they were already scheduled to be due to an "in-service" day. That's fortunate.

[mrkelley23]

And my school system (the one I attended, which happens to be the same one I currently teach in)

That's cool. So we should call you mrkotter?

Pretty darn close except I have the opposite end as the Sweathogs. My district has five public high schools, though, and I teach at one, graduated from another, and send my kids to a third.

Makes it really tough to find city games to ump where I don't have to do some kind of disclosure beforehand....

[Appa23]

Let me repeat it one more time. If you have a school day that follows Commencement, after the seniors' grades have been finalized and their diplomas have been printed, they will not show up. Honestly, in any mixed class, we would not want them to, because they would be a distraction. If one fourth of your school is missing, then you have a maximum of 75% attendance.

Family vacations have, obviously, already been worked around the schedule. If you change that schedule without much warning, most parents (I realize that you are an exception to this rule) are not going to cancel their cruises, plane tickets, etc., just because of an extra day being added.

Do me a favor. The next time Omaha is in this situation, with extra days having to be added to the calendar, attend whatever school any of your kids is currently going to. I'm sure it won't be a problem for you to take a day off work, because education is just that important to you. Note the attendance rate. Note the lesson plans (you will never see so many "parties," if elementary school, or videos, if high school).

I say this from experience both from my public school and my brother's kids' private schools.

And my school system (the one I attended, which happens to be the same one I currently teach in) also had more days built into the schedule than the state required, but when the state upped its requirements, the district didn't have enough money to add yet more days to its calendar. So now they match.

OK. I was not think of the Seniors being that "25% missing". I was thinking of those that actually were required to be at school. (I have never heard of Seniors having to do the "tacked on" days.)

Because of a "too darn cold to have kids waiting for a bus" day, we will have an extra day of school added to the end. I will check out the attendence rate. (well, my wife will, as she likely will be at school that day.)

I already have admitted that this is a foreign concept to me. I never had days tacked on to school, and this will be the first year (granted, out of a whopping two) that my son will have to go to school longer. (I am presuming that our school district only has scheduled to meet the minimum number of days/hours if all of the planned weather days are used.)

[mrkelley23]

Yup, I guess I should have made that clearer, about the seniors being the missing 25%. But the State doesn't care. We have to hit 90 to 95% attendance for the day to "count." And that percentage is applied to the entire school population, seniors included, so we're screwed on that tack-on day, if that's indeed when we do it.

I'm all for teaching as many meaningful days as the contract allows for. It is very rare that we have to make these kinds of decisions, because Evansville doesn't get that much snow, and we always have 4 or 5 built in make up days, and we usually don't have a green super, either. I just wish there was a better solution for the extreme cases than there is.

[PlacentiaSoccerMom]

We have received automatic messages talking about ADA and how important the money is to the school.

I will admit that there have been some days that I have had my kids show up for a few minutes to have it "count," then I take them home.

If they are really sick, like Emma has been this week, I do not.
Tuesday night she had been up all night coughing and blowing her nose, so I didn't wake her up to go to school.