Or at least I think there will be a lot of those kind of calls if they do hit the satellite.
http://www.cnn.com/2008/TECH/space/02/1 ... index.html
Asst. Chief Swampy Turtles may get a lot of phone calls. Or at least the station will.
Apparently they think the lunar eclipse will help with the tracking of bits and pieces.
UFO's near Hawai'i
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christie1111
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UFO's near Hawai'i
"A bed without a quilt is like the sky without stars"
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peacock2121
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nitrah55
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MarleysGh0st
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Re: UFO's near Hawai'i
Thanks for the reminder!christie1111 wrote:Apparently they think the lunar eclipse will help with the tracking of bits and pieces.
A total lunar eclipse will be visible tomorrow night.
http://www.skyandtelescope.com/observin ... 57796.html
Earth’s shadow will totally engulf the Moon from 10:00 to 10:52 p.m. Eastern Standard Time, or 7:00 to 7:52 p.m. Pacific Standard Time, as shown at lower right. The partial phases of the eclipse last for about an hour and a quarter before and after totality.
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themanintheseersuckersuit
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- Location: South Carolina
More information than you might want on the proposed shootdown
http://blog.wired.com/defense/2008/02/s ... -down.html
http://blog.wired.com/defense/2008/02/s ... -down.html
More startling, veteran satellite-watcher AT says, is where the debris cloud will go. "To my considerable surprise, it's on an ascending pass that will take the debris cloud across central Canada a few minutes later. Then across a bit of western Africa and eastern Australia.
Suitguy is not bitter.
feels he represents the many educated and rational onlookers who believe that the hysterical denouncement of lay scepticism is both unwarranted and counter-productive
The problem, then, is that such calls do not address an opposition audience so much as they signal virtue. They talk past those who need convincing. They ignore actual facts and counterargument. And they are irreparably smug.
feels he represents the many educated and rational onlookers who believe that the hysterical denouncement of lay scepticism is both unwarranted and counter-productive
The problem, then, is that such calls do not address an opposition audience so much as they signal virtue. They talk past those who need convincing. They ignore actual facts and counterargument. And they are irreparably smug.
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PlacentiaSoccerMom
- Posts: 8134
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- Location: Placentia, CA
- Contact:
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PlacentiaSoccerMom
- Posts: 8134
- Joined: Mon Oct 08, 2007 10:47 am
- Location: Placentia, CA
- Contact:
http://blog.wired.com/defense/2008/02/f ... onale.html
"There has to be another reason behind this," said Michael Krepon, co-founder of the Henry L. Stimson Center, tells the Washington Post. "In the history of the space age, there has not been a single human being who has been harmed by man-made objects falling from space."
So what could that other reason be?
Our veteran space security specialist believes there are several. To him, the satellite shot is a chance for the military to try out its missile defense capabilities; a way to keep secret material out of the wrong hands; and a warning to the Chinese, after they destroyed a satellite about a year ago. He shared some educated guesses:
My first thought is that MDA [Missile Defense Agency] is always looking for ways to pimp their systems and provide further justification that they work. The upcoming change in Administration is almost guaranteed to result in missile defense losing the top-level advocacy that it has enjoyed for the last several years. Any additional missions and justifications that the missile defense community can provide would increase the likelihood of their systems (and budgetary power) surviving.
An additional reason could be that destroying the satellite would prevent any chance of another nation getting access to any of the potentially sensitive technology on board. However, I have heard from other sources that supposedly the NRO [National Reconnaissance Office - the country's spy satellite shop] is actually against the "shootdown" (and I hate that term - the satellite is not flying and is coming down regardless of whether or not it gets hit by a missile). Their absence at the press briefing could lend some weight to this rumor, although it could also be explained by the nature of the satellite and its still classified link to the NRO.
My real concern is that this is simply a knee-jerk reaction made by the Administration in response to the purported threat by the Chinese. Since the April 2007 ASAT [anti-satellite] test, there have been rumors and whispers going around that the Administration and like-minded individuals are looking for more sticks (instead of carrots) to use against China. While this "shoot down" is not a direct action against China, it would be a clear signal that the US can possess an active ASAT capability at any time if it so desires. That is a serious development as the previous US ASAT system using F-15s was mothballed in the 1980's.
There are many significant political ramifications that would happen as a result of this. The US has been berating the Chinese on their ASAT test but now demonstrate that it is okay as long as it occurs at a low enough altitude to prevent long-lasting debris and can "save lives". This is close to an implied "ok" for the US and other nations to conduct more ASAT tests, which could open another arms race. I am also certain that Russian and China would also see this as a slap in the face as they are trying to revive the Peaceful Uses of Outer Space treaty discussion and ban on space weapons. It would further negatively affect the relations between them and the US. Which could lead to increased tensions, arms buildup, etc etc etc. Nothing good for anyone outside of arms manufacturers and politicians that need a bogeyman to scare people into voting for them.
Oh, and [NASA Adminsitrator Mike] Griffin's presence at the briefing was also an indicator to me that they are trying to spin this as a safety issue and not a missile defense / ASAT test. NASA has absolutely nothing to do with US Strategic Command using a Navy missile to blow up a broken NRO satellite. This is a military/national security op from the start and the only reason you trot the NASA Administrator out is to try and convince people otherwise.
"There has to be another reason behind this," said Michael Krepon, co-founder of the Henry L. Stimson Center, tells the Washington Post. "In the history of the space age, there has not been a single human being who has been harmed by man-made objects falling from space."
So what could that other reason be?
Our veteran space security specialist believes there are several. To him, the satellite shot is a chance for the military to try out its missile defense capabilities; a way to keep secret material out of the wrong hands; and a warning to the Chinese, after they destroyed a satellite about a year ago. He shared some educated guesses:
My first thought is that MDA [Missile Defense Agency] is always looking for ways to pimp their systems and provide further justification that they work. The upcoming change in Administration is almost guaranteed to result in missile defense losing the top-level advocacy that it has enjoyed for the last several years. Any additional missions and justifications that the missile defense community can provide would increase the likelihood of their systems (and budgetary power) surviving.
An additional reason could be that destroying the satellite would prevent any chance of another nation getting access to any of the potentially sensitive technology on board. However, I have heard from other sources that supposedly the NRO [National Reconnaissance Office - the country's spy satellite shop] is actually against the "shootdown" (and I hate that term - the satellite is not flying and is coming down regardless of whether or not it gets hit by a missile). Their absence at the press briefing could lend some weight to this rumor, although it could also be explained by the nature of the satellite and its still classified link to the NRO.
My real concern is that this is simply a knee-jerk reaction made by the Administration in response to the purported threat by the Chinese. Since the April 2007 ASAT [anti-satellite] test, there have been rumors and whispers going around that the Administration and like-minded individuals are looking for more sticks (instead of carrots) to use against China. While this "shoot down" is not a direct action against China, it would be a clear signal that the US can possess an active ASAT capability at any time if it so desires. That is a serious development as the previous US ASAT system using F-15s was mothballed in the 1980's.
There are many significant political ramifications that would happen as a result of this. The US has been berating the Chinese on their ASAT test but now demonstrate that it is okay as long as it occurs at a low enough altitude to prevent long-lasting debris and can "save lives". This is close to an implied "ok" for the US and other nations to conduct more ASAT tests, which could open another arms race. I am also certain that Russian and China would also see this as a slap in the face as they are trying to revive the Peaceful Uses of Outer Space treaty discussion and ban on space weapons. It would further negatively affect the relations between them and the US. Which could lead to increased tensions, arms buildup, etc etc etc. Nothing good for anyone outside of arms manufacturers and politicians that need a bogeyman to scare people into voting for them.
Oh, and [NASA Adminsitrator Mike] Griffin's presence at the briefing was also an indicator to me that they are trying to spin this as a safety issue and not a missile defense / ASAT test. NASA has absolutely nothing to do with US Strategic Command using a Navy missile to blow up a broken NRO satellite. This is a military/national security op from the start and the only reason you trot the NASA Administrator out is to try and convince people otherwise.
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VAdame
- Posts: 1877
- Joined: Wed Oct 10, 2007 11:42 am
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If you want to try to see the spy satellite before it's *gone* -- go to this site:
http://www.heavens-above.com/?lat=40.43 ... and&TZ=EST
Set it for your own location (you can get it from the map, select it from the database of cities & towns, or put in your own latitude/longitude if you know it -- just follow the links.)
It should be visible from my back porch in about an hour & 10 minutes. I tried for it yesterday evening, but the sky was still pretty light & the satellite wasn't quite as bright on that pass. Plus, my good binoculars were out in the car & I was too lazy to go get them!
Tonight it'll probably still be pretty light out, but the pass will be higher & brighter, & I have the binocs.
Will let yinz know if I'm successful in spotting it.
http://www.heavens-above.com/?lat=40.43 ... and&TZ=EST
Set it for your own location (you can get it from the map, select it from the database of cities & towns, or put in your own latitude/longitude if you know it -- just follow the links.)
It should be visible from my back porch in about an hour & 10 minutes. I tried for it yesterday evening, but the sky was still pretty light & the satellite wasn't quite as bright on that pass. Plus, my good binoculars were out in the car & I was too lazy to go get them!
Tonight it'll probably still be pretty light out, but the pass will be higher & brighter, & I have the binocs.
Will let yinz know if I'm successful in spotting it.
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VAdame
- Posts: 1877
- Joined: Wed Oct 10, 2007 11:42 am
- Location: da 'Burgh!
Ooh, I just check Heavens-Above again -- turns out the Space Shuttle & the ISS will be visible a few minutes before the USA-193 pass -- in fact, they may "cross paths" in the sky! That should be quite a sight 
I only wish it would happen a little later in the evening, since it'll only be a few minutes after sunset & the sky will still be pretty light. But I'll go out & take a look anyhow. There are some big scattered clouds but plenty of clear sky in between.
I only wish it would happen a little later in the evening, since it'll only be a few minutes after sunset & the sky will still be pretty light. But I'll go out & take a look anyhow. There are some big scattered clouds but plenty of clear sky in between.
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VAdame
- Posts: 1877
- Joined: Wed Oct 10, 2007 11:42 am
- Location: da 'Burgh!
Well, no luck seeing any of 'em -- the sky was still too light, and too many clouds.
Looks like it'll be cloudy for the early part of tonight's eclipse, but may clear up about half-way through. I'm not going anywhere too watch it -- too cold, plus I don't want to have to gas up the car till Friday (payday) -- but I'll probably set up the 80mm refractor out on the front walk & try a little sidewalk astronomy
I'll probably take these out too:
http://www.binoculars.com/binoculars/lo ... ocular.cfm
They're great, but I haven't gotten a tripod for them yet! It's pretty hard to hold those big suckers steady. I checked out a few other folks' tripods & binoc mounts at this past weekend's Winterfest Star Party but I'm not sure what kind will fit my needs and my pocketbook. Whatever I get, it'll probably cost more than the 20x80's themselves!
I would love to get a parallelogram mount -- maybe one that could be adapted to fit my telescope tripod -- but those run into the BIG bucks.
Looks like it'll be cloudy for the early part of tonight's eclipse, but may clear up about half-way through. I'm not going anywhere too watch it -- too cold, plus I don't want to have to gas up the car till Friday (payday) -- but I'll probably set up the 80mm refractor out on the front walk & try a little sidewalk astronomy
I'll probably take these out too:
http://www.binoculars.com/binoculars/lo ... ocular.cfm
They're great, but I haven't gotten a tripod for them yet! It's pretty hard to hold those big suckers steady. I checked out a few other folks' tripods & binoc mounts at this past weekend's Winterfest Star Party but I'm not sure what kind will fit my needs and my pocketbook. Whatever I get, it'll probably cost more than the 20x80's themselves!
I would love to get a parallelogram mount -- maybe one that could be adapted to fit my telescope tripod -- but those run into the BIG bucks.