What is a lie?

[silvercamaro]

I don't think that UPS delivers to PO Boxes.

Or to anybody on Saturday or Sunday. I am all in favour of the mandate being lifted on Saturday delivery in order to bring down costs, btw. I still think 44 cents is a darned good deal on a letter but, as other ebayers would probably agree, the other rates have skyrocketed the past couple years and will probably continue to do so to keep down the costs of the first class postage stamp, since that's the only cost that the general public seems to get outraged about when rates go up.

And, while UPS would theoretically deliver to anywhere, they can charge any damned thing they want to get it there. So, if you don't want to deliver a piano to the top of Gobbler's Knob, but want to say you'll go anywhere, just make the cost so outrageous that nobody will take you up on it.

So there are addresses that UPS surcharges for? PO Boxes and Saturday delivery?

UPS also can invoke what it terms as a "rural delivery" charge. UPS cannot make any deliveries to Post Office boxes.

[Jeemie]

For the most part, education does (or, did).

Although the private schools still do better, for the most part.

There's no question that private enterprise can run things better than the government. However, they can also fail spectacularly. In the private sector, when Circuit City goes under, there's a Best Buy to step in. If GM and Chrysler go under, Ford and the foreigners are ready to step in. That's how capitalism works.

However, we feel that some things are too important to fail. Would you want the army run by Enron? So we trade off, accepting a less than optimum level of service in exchange for an overall acceptable level of reliability.

There's no question that the best (and most expensive) private health care available is better, in most cases, that what would be available under government health care. However, that care isn't always available except for the very rich anyway, and, in many cases, the only time it makes an appreciable difference is in certain rare situations. So to avoid the boogeyman of government health care, we put up with millions uninsured, millions more knowingly underinsured, and still millions more unknowingly underinsured (you don't know you're underinsured until you're really sick and you find our your "good" insurance won't cover it).

Tell the poor and inner-city kids that the publicly-run school system hasn't failed them.

Even government-run systems tend to favor the wealthy over the poor.

That's just how life works.

[silverscreenselect]

SSS perhaps you can find something for me. I was looking for a list of addresses that the USPS delivers to that UPS doesn't.

Maybe its just me but that seems a bit non-responsive.

Your question didn't refer to what I said. I didn't say that UPS and Fedex don't provide their form of service to every location (frankly, I don't know if there are places where they don't deliver or not), but they don't provide first class mail service. If they were required/able to provide first class mail service (pickups and deliveries everywhere in the country six days a week), they wouldn't do it for 44 cents. They would probably set it up as a subscription service and charge a weekly or monthly fee for people to sign up for the service.

UPS and Fedex decide where they will deliver, when they will deliver, how they will deliver, and how much they charge for the delivery. If it doesn't fit in their business model, they don't do it, just as McDonalds doesn't sell prime rib and lobster.

[Lackadaisical Stumblebum]

I don't think that UPS delivers to PO Boxes.

Or to anybody on Saturday or Sunday. I am all in favour of the mandate being lifted on Saturday delivery in order to bring down costs, btw. I still think 44 cents is a darned good deal on a letter but, as other ebayers would probably agree, the other rates have skyrocketed the past couple years and will probably continue to do so to keep down the costs of the first class postage stamp, since that's the only cost that the general public seems to get outraged about when rates go up.

And, while UPS would theoretically deliver to anywhere, they can charge any damned thing they want to get it there. So, if you don't want to deliver a piano to the top of Gobbler's Knob, but want to say you'll go anywhere, just make the cost so outrageous that nobody will take you up on it.

So there are addresses that UPS surcharges for? PO Boxes and Saturday delivery?

They do not deliver to PO Boxes.

For extra surcharges and Next Day Air prices, I think they deliver on Saturdays (in some areas, but not all) but they do not deliver on Sundays or holidays no matter what.

[Jeemie]

just as McDonalds doesn't sell prime rib and lobster.

They sell McRibs in some parts of the country and McLobsters in Maine!

[themanintheseersuckersuit]

I don't think that UPS delivers to PO Boxes.

Or to anybody on Saturday or Sunday. I am all in favour of the mandate being lifted on Saturday delivery in order to bring down costs, btw. I still think 44 cents is a darned good deal on a letter but, as other ebayers would probably agree, the other rates have skyrocketed the past couple years and will probably continue to do so to keep down the costs of the first class postage stamp, since that's the only cost that the general public seems to get outraged about when rates go up.

And, while UPS would theoretically deliver to anywhere, they can charge any damned thing they want to get it there. So, if you don't want to deliver a piano to the top of Gobbler's Knob, but want to say you'll go anywhere, just make the cost so outrageous that nobody will take you up on it.

So there are addresses that UPS surcharges for? PO Boxes and Saturday delivery?

UPS also can invoke what it terms as a "rural delivery" charge. UPS cannot make any deliveries to Post Office boxes.

Thanks for the tip.

One of the most surprising changes—UPS will now have two rural Delivery Area Surcharge lists—a "regular" DAS list, up 10 cents to $1.60 for commercial addresses and $2.40 for residential addresses, and a brand new "Extended DAS" list, which is an additional $0.25 surcharge on top of the regular DAS surcharge. The new "Extended" DAS applies only to Residential shipments, at least for 2009 (it's listed as a "no charge" item for commercial addresses). More than 75 million people now live in a ZIP Code subject to at least one of these "rural" area charges—over 25% of the US population. And nearly 50 million of those people are now subject to the new, 25-cent Extended charge.

Residential shipments addressed to these new Extended areas will now pay a total of $2.65 for the rural component. Keep in mind that rural charges are also subject to fuel surcharges, so this new Extended Surcharge could easily top $3. While most of these ZIP Codes are in truly rural areas, others are decidedly not. (Take ultra-chic Malibu California 90265, home to Tom Hanks, Barbara Streisand, Dustin Hoffman and scores of other stars—yes, it's now on the "rural" list.!)

[silverscreenselect]

Getting back to the original subject of this thread, this is from a rightwing site, but it's a remarkably evenhanded comment about the healthcare crisis, which eschews the usual right wing talking points (socialism, death panels, etc.). If I wrote about this at length and tried to keep my anti-Obamaism in check, I'd have come up with something fairly close to this.

http://www.floppingaces.net/2009/08/13/ ... more-26310

[flockofseagulls104]

Getting back to the original subject of this thread: Has anyone heard of Obama explaining his apparent lie? Or are we all paid, un-american members of a vast right wing mob? (If so, I want my check!)

Seeing the way they report on the townhall meetings, where were all these media types when Code Pink, Move-on and their ilk was harassing Bush all during his administration? Those left wing lunatics seem to have gotten a little more respect and credibility from the mainstream media than the average people finally voicing the first amendment rights to their elected representatives. I don't know how anyone can NOT see how biased the mainstream media is.

[Thousandaire]

For extra surcharges and Next Day Air prices, I think they deliver on Saturdays (in some areas, but not all) but they do not deliver on Sundays or holidays no matter what.

They will deliver on holidays for a price (It's called UPS Express Critical). So does FedEx.

[Bob78164]

Getting back to the original subject of this thread: Has anyone heard of Obama explaining his apparent lie? Or are we all paid, un-american members of a vast right wing mob? (If so, I want my check!)

Obama's later statement was undoubtedly incorrect, but that doesn't make it a lie, which would imply he did it deliberately. In my opinion, it was almost certainly an honest mistake, if nothing else because if he knew what he was saying was false, he would also have to have known that the falsehood would be easily exposed.

So I guess you score one "gotcha." Congratulations. --Bob

[flockofseagulls104]

Obama's later statement was undoubtedly incorrect, but that doesn't make it a lie, which would imply he did it deliberately. In my opinion, it was almost certainly an honest mistake, if nothing else because if he knew what he was saying was false, he would also have to have known that the falsehood would be easily exposed.

Oh, Bob, I doubt you'd be so understanding about any conservative making an honest mistake.

I think if I was in the same position and someone asked me about my stance on, say, building a nuclear power plant, I doubt I would say that I have never said I was against building new ones. I was, many years ago, a kneejerk participant in the old Nuclear Moratorium marches, (mostly because of the concerts attached to the rally). I don't think I could honestly make that mistake and say I was never against Nuclear Power. And I wasn't even being interviewed at the time.

I think he was talking out of the side of his mouth to convey a false impression. I think he knew exactly what he was doing.

[Spock]

Obama's later statement was undoubtedly incorrect, but that doesn't make it a lie, which would imply he did it deliberately. In my opinion, it was almost certainly an honest mistake, if nothing else because if he knew what he was saying was false, he would also have to have known that the falsehood would be easily exposed.

Oh, Bob, I doubt you'd be so understanding about any conservative making an honest mistake.

I think if I was in the same position and someone asked me about my stance on, say, building a nuclear power plant, I doubt I would say that I have never said I was against building new ones. I was, many years ago, a kneejerk participant in the old Nuclear Moratorium marches, (mostly because of the concerts attached to the rally). I don't think I could honestly make that mistake and say I was never against Nuclear Power. And I wasn't even being interviewed at the time.

I think he was talking out of the side of his mouth to convey a false impression. I think he knew exactly what he was doing.

Come on Flock-tell the whole truth-It really wasn't the concerts was it-it was the easy hippie chicks, wasn't it?

[silverscreenselect]

I think he was talking out of the side of his mouth to convey a false impression. I think he knew exactly what he was doing.

Obama has mastered the art of saying whatever he thinks he needs to the audience at hand and then explaining away his answers on those rare occasions he gets called on the carpet for inconsistencies. His supporters and the press almost always seem to buy it. A lot of times, he doesn't have to explain himself; his supporters come up with the explanations for him.

It's the same mindset that explains away every blunder he makes with the rationalization that he's just engaged in some sort of highly sophisticated strategic game with his opponents, be they Republicans or Iranians, that we mere mortals just haven't been able to figure out yet but that somehow it will work out in the end as he planned.