What is a lie?

[Bob78164]

So busing in a bunch of union thugs, filing the front rows of a town hall meeting with union sympathizers who were escorted in through the side door and put in the front rows, while Joe Constiuent has to wait outside until the preferreds are seat[ed] . . . .

That's twice you've said that happened. I haven't seen any references to it anywhere else. Please provide sources.

There has been extensive coverage of disruptive conduct at town halls across the nation, and a decent amount of coverage of the organizational efforts of groups like Armey's (whose name escapes me at the moment). --Bob

[Estonut]

Perhaps I missed something somewhere, but I don't understand why the term is disgusting. After all, there was an organized movement early in the Obama Administration to use teabags as an instrument of political protest. "Teabaggers" appears an appropriate description of the participants and organizers.

Why don't you knock off the lawyerly doubletalk and Google it, then?

Because I expected, and got, a quicker and more trustworthy answer from the Bored.

And if by "lawyerly doubletalk" you mean a clear statement of my position, I don't see anything wrong with that either. --Bob

No, by "lawyerly doubletalk," I meant your rationalization for using the term, when you knew damn good and well what was the derivation of it. Just like Bubba and what "is" was...

[Bob78164]

No, by "lawyerly doubletalk," I meant your rationalization for using the term, when you knew damn good and well what was the derivation of it.

No, I didn't. Hard as it is for me to believe sometimes, I'm not perfect. It did take me nine tries to qualify through the phone game. --Bob

[BigDrawMan]

So busing in a bunch of union thugs, filing the front rows of a town hall meeting with union sympathizers who were escorted in through the side door and put in the front rows, while Joe Constiuent has to wait outside until the preferreds are seat[ed] . . . .

That's twice you've said that happened. I haven't seen any references to it anywhere else. Please provide sources.

There has been extensive coverage of disruptive conduct at town halls across the nation, and a decent amount of coverage of the organizational efforts of groups like Armey's (whose name escapes me at the moment). --Bob

Freedomworks.org

a "grass roots" organization bankrolled by Steve Forbes and various corporate interests

It was interesting watching the meeting in Lebanon.It took .023 seconds to tell the genuine concerned citizens from the plants.They dint need a fistfull of downloaded talking points.

I wonder if the Continental Congress was infiltrated by PR hacks.

[Estonut]

No, by "lawyerly doubletalk," I meant your rationalization for using the term, when you knew damn good and well what was the derivation of it.

No, I didn't. Hard as it is for me to believe sometimes, I'm not perfect. It did take me nine tries to qualify through the phone game. --Bob

OK, then. I apologize for overestimating your hipness...

[Ritterskoop]

A lie is when you say something you know is false.

It does not include changing your position, misunderstanding the situation, or unknowingly saying an untruth.

[Bob78164]

3. Would you submit to being operated on by the healthcare equivelent of the average postal worker?

This is a false comparison.

I'll keep saying it as often as necessary. No one is talking about government health care, such as they have in the U.K. We are talking about government health insurance.

And by the way, if you address an envelope (with your return address) simply to "My Congressman," the USPS will deliver it correctly. I doubt that FedEx or UPS would. --Bob

[SportsFan68]

Are you being serious here?

Kiki might be able to enlighten you....

Yes. --Bob

I'll spoil for the delicate of constitution.

Spoiler

Teabagging refers to the act (generally used in a homosexual sense) of a male squatting over another person and putting their testicles in and out of the other person's mouth. It's called teabagging because the up and down motion is like when you're steeping a cup of tea.

I will also agree with Estonut and Calvinator (!) that I am disappointed to see Sprots using that term. I expect that sort of thing from Nelly, but not from her.

I proffer my apologies. I thought that's how they referred to themselves (they do not) and that it was a commonly accepted term. I have no defense, because it was so obviously offensive to so many here. I will note that it is used, apparently with the expectation that it would be accepted as a shortcut term for the people who hosted the recent tea parties and who more lately have disrupted health care reform town hall meetings, in the mainstream media outlets Florida Times Union, Kansas City Star, CBS News, Detroit Free Press, and Fox News. That was my expectation, and i'm sorry I was wrong.

I knew about the less common use because of a remark on the Bored here and assumed that it was on the same order of the less common use of the term milkshake, which I also knew about because of a remark on the Bored here. Bad assumption, I now note.

I would change it, but it's too late for that.

[BigDrawMan]

Yes. --Bob

I'll spoil for the delicate of constitution.

Spoiler

Teabagging refers to the act (generally used in a homosexual sense) of a male squatting over another person and putting their testicles in and out of the other person's mouth. It's called teabagging because the up and down motion is like when you're steeping a cup of tea.

I will also agree with Estonut and Calvinator (!) that I am disappointed to see Sprots using that term. I expect that sort of thing from Nelly, but not from her.

I proffer my apologies. I thought that's how they referred to themselves (they do not) and that it was a commonly accepted term. I have no defense, because it was so obviously offensive to so many here. I will note that it is used, apparently with the expectation that it would be accepted as a shortcut term for the people who hosted the recent tea parties and who more lately have disrupted health care reform town hall meetings, in the mainstream media outlets Florida Times Union, Kansas City Star, CBS News, Detroit Free Press, and Fox News. That was my expectation, and i'm sorry I was wrong.

I knew about the less common use because of a remark on the Bored here and assumed that it was on the same order of the less common use of the term milkshake, which I also knew about because of a remark on the Bored here. Bad assumption, I now note.


some of them do refer to themselves that way.

I am sure you will hear it

[Estonut]

I will note that it is used, apparently with the expectation that it would be accepted as a shortcut term for the people who hosted the recent tea parties and who more lately have disrupted health care reform town hall meetings, in the mainstream media outlets Florida Times Union, Kansas City Star, CBS News, Detroit Free Press, and Fox News.

I think you have Fox News in the wrong boat. A search of their website yields only these 2 references:

Showing Results 1 - 2 of 2 for teabaggers

» St. Louis Tea Party Live Blog Team Washington « FOXNews.com
By guestcontributor| Team Washington
… out. We could help them figure it out. Gina Louden is up next! sany10991 7:11 Gina-MSNBC Called us "toothless teabaggers " we know our way of life is at risk. We believe our republic may be at risk. WAKE UP AMERICA! 7:15 "Save our republic …
Blogs|04/15/2009

FOX News Exclusive
Full clip of Janeane Garofalo refusing to apologize for 'racist teabaggers' comment
Video|05/12/2009|More from Politics

[Bob78164]

Freedomworks.org

a "grass roots" organization bankrolled by Steve Forbes and various corporate interests.

I believe the accepted term is "Astroturf." Unless that's developed some sexually suggestive meaning I'm not aware of. --Bob

[Lackadaisical Stumblebum]

I will also agree with Estonut and Calvinator (!) that I am disappointed to see Sprots using that term. I expect that sort of thing from Nelly, but not from her.

I proffer my apologies. I thought that's how they referred to themselves (they do not) and that it was a commonly accepted term. I have no defense, because it was so obviously offensive to so many here. I will note that it is used, apparently with the expectation that it would be accepted as a shortcut term for the people who hosted the recent tea parties and who more lately have disrupted health care reform town hall meetings, in the mainstream media outlets Florida Times Union, Kansas City Star, CBS News, Detroit Free Press, and Fox News. That was my expectation, and i'm sorry I was wrong.

I knew about the less common use because of a remark on the Bored here and assumed that it was on the same order of the less common use of the term milkshake, which I also knew about because of a remark on the Bored here. Bad assumption, I now note.

I would change it, but it's too late for that.

Thanks, Sprots. As your response here shows, you have no need to apologize. I think highly of you and was so surprised that you'd stoop to the derision that so many (on both sides, both here and elsewhere) so often do.

I thought that it must have been done unknowingly and I am happy to know that was the case.

[SportsFan68]

I will note that it is used, apparently with the expectation that it would be accepted as a shortcut term for the people who hosted the recent tea parties and who more lately have disrupted health care reform town hall meetings, in the mainstream media outlets Florida Times Union, Kansas City Star, CBS News, Detroit Free Press, and Fox News.

I think you have Fox News in the wrong boat. A search of their website yields only these 2 references:

Showing Results 1 - 2 of 2 for teabaggers

» St. Louis Tea Party Live Blog Team Washington « FOXNews.com
By guestcontributor| Team Washington
… out. We could help them figure it out. Gina Louden is up next! sany10991 7:11 Gina-MSNBC Called us "toothless teabaggers " we know our way of life is at risk. We believe our republic may be at risk. WAKE UP AMERICA! 7:15 "Save our republic …
Blogs|04/15/2009

FOX News Exclusive
Full clip of Janeane Garofalo refusing to apologize for 'racist teabaggers' comment
Video|05/12/2009|More from Politics

No, I don't. They're a mainstream media outlet, and they used it, including outside the two references cited here.

[BackInTex]

So busing in a bunch of union thugs, filing the front rows of a town hall meeting with union sympathizers who were escorted in through the side door and put in the front rows, while Joe Constiuent has to wait outside until the preferreds are seat[ed] . . . .

That's twice you've said that happened. I haven't seen any references to it anywhere else. Please provide sources.

There has been extensive coverage of disruptive conduct at town halls across the nation, and a decent amount of coverage of the organizational efforts of groups like Armey's (whose name escapes me at the moment). --Bob

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=Ke ... f&oq=&aqi=

Take your pick of the results.

What is interesting is that when you search for Ken Gladney on CNN or USA Today, you get nothing. It is not a story they wish to report.

Hey, maybe it's all a dream......

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&ei=3 ... ll&spell=1

Still a dream.. Just a bunch of videos showing what happend but no "legitimate" news sight reports it. If Bush looked wrong at a liberal it was reported.

[SportsFan68]

some of them do refer to themselves that way.

I am sure you will hear it

Thanks, BDM. I'm sure you're right.

[SportsFan68]

I will also agree with Estonut and Calvinator (!) that I am disappointed to see Sprots using that term. I expect that sort of thing from Nelly, but not from her.

I proffer my apologies. I thought that's how they referred to themselves (they do not) and that it was a commonly accepted term. I have no defense, because it was so obviously offensive to so many here. I will note that it is used, apparently with the expectation that it would be accepted as a shortcut term for the people who hosted the recent tea parties and who more lately have disrupted health care reform town hall meetings, in the mainstream media outlets Florida Times Union, Kansas City Star, CBS News, Detroit Free Press, and Fox News. That was my expectation, and i'm sorry I was wrong.

I knew about the less common use because of a remark on the Bored here and assumed that it was on the same order of the less common use of the term milkshake, which I also knew about because of a remark on the Bored here. Bad assumption, I now note.

I would change it, but it's too late for that.

Thanks, Sprots. As your response here shows, you have no need to apologize. I think highly of you and was so surprised that you'd stoop to the derision that so many (on both sides, both here and elsewhere) so often do.

I thought that it must have been done unknowingly and I am happy to know that was the case.

You're very kind, Fan. If it had been completely unknowingly, I wouldn't have apologized. What I missed and apologized for was the generally accepted derision part. It seemed to me a neutral metonymic term, and I missed the mark.

[Bob78164]

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=Ke ... f&oq=&aqi=

Take your pick of the results.

What is interesting is that when you search for Ken Gladney on CNN or USA Today, you get nothing. It is not a story they wish to report.

Hey, maybe it's all a dream......

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&ei=3 ... ll&spell=1

Still a dream.. Just a bunch of videos showing what happend but no "legitimate" news sight reports it. If Bush looked wrong at a liberal it was reported.

The St. Louis Post Dispatch reported it. Of course, they don't tell it quite the way you see it.

For one thing, the Carnahan town hall was supposed to be about aging, not the health insurance plan. For another Representative Carnahan criticized both sides for their conduct.

And by the way, the correct noun to refer to constituents of a union is "members," not "thugs." --Bob

[TheCalvinator24]

And by the way, the correct noun to refer to constituents of a union is "members," not "thugs." --Bob

All are members. Some members are thugs.

[Bob78164]

And by the way, the correct noun to refer to constituents of a union is "members," not "thugs." --Bob

All are members. Some members are thugs.

Judging from his usage, BiT doesn't seem to see it that way. He is implying that the union members admitted to the town halls were thugs, when the only evidence (based on T shirts) is that they are union members (generally of SEIU).

And of course, precisely the same thing could be said about conservative protestors. --Bob

[Beebs52]

So busing in a bunch of union thugs, filing the front rows of a town hall meeting with union sympathizers who were escorted in through the side door and put in the front rows, while Joe Constiuent has to wait outside until the preferreds are seat[ed] . . . .

That's twice you've said that happened. I haven't seen any references to it anywhere else. Please provide sources.

There has been extensive coverage of disruptive conduct at town halls across the nation, and a decent amount of coverage of the organizational efforts of groups like Armey's (whose name escapes me at the moment). --Bob

Freedomworks.org

a "grass roots" organization bankrolled by Steve Forbes and various corporate interests

It was interesting watching the meeting in Lebanon.It took .023 seconds to tell the genuine concerned citizens from the plants.They dint need a fistfull of downloaded talking points.

I wonder if the Continental Congress was infiltrated by PR hacks.

Oh, Beedums,you silly goose. Er, duck master. George Soros anyone?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/di ... 02x4008832

Edited to provide a non "conservative" link.

[SportsFan68]

(((((rueful laugh)))))

And everything else I posted is lost.

That works, though. I'd rather talk about sports anyway.

Go Broncos!

Jay Cutler's getting even more press than when we had him. Good luck to him, I say.

[BackInTex]

It was interesting watching the meeting in Lebanon.It took .023 seconds to tell the genuine concerned citizens from the plants.

Hmmm.... So people who protest are not "genuine concerned citizens"?

Or are you bragging you know the difference between homo sapien americanas and a ficus?

Or are you talking about the little girl who Obama called on the ask a question? Her father was a huge contributor to the Obama campaign. But I'm sure it was all unplanned.

[Bob78164]

It was interesting watching the meeting in Lebanon.It took .023 seconds to tell the genuine concerned citizens from the plants.

Hmmm.... So people who protest are not "genuine concerned citizens"?

Or are you bragging you know the difference between homo sapien americanas and a ficus?

Or are you talking about the little girl who Obama called on the ask a question? Her father was a huge contributor to the Obama campaign. But I'm sure it was all unplanned.

You screwed up your quote tags. I'm not Beedums, nor do I play him on TV. --Bob

[Jeemie]

A lie is when you say something you know is false.

It does not include changing your position, misunderstanding the situation, or unknowingly saying an untruth.

Obama didn't claim to have changed his position.

He claimed to never have said he was a supporter of a single-payer system.

[Spock]

Meanwhile the private sector, which won't be able to compete with an entity that has no responsibility to be efficient or profitable, and cannot be sued, will all go by the wayside.

Kind of like how FedEx and UPS find it impossible to compete with the Postal Service? --Bob

Bad analogy, Bob, because as you surely realize, the USPS does not get to set the rates for Fed EX and UPS. They also do not mandate what routes the private competion has to cover and so forth, etc, etc.

However, as you also realize, under the forthcoming health regime-the Government option will be setting rates and mandating coverages (etc, etc) for the "Private Competitors."

I also got a kick out of the other part of the Obama USPS analogy where he said UPS and Fed Ex are doing great and the USPS is the one in trouble. So tell me again, why are following the USPS model for our healthcare?