Two boys attack a student at my daughter' school

[geoffil]

Two boys age 11 and 12 viciously attacked and raped another student age 11, at his home on Nov. 11. The two boys will have a trial in juvenile court, but the date has not been released. Meanwhile those 2 boys are allowed to ride the bus and attend classes with the victim. The boy's father is outraged saying his son has to see these attackers every day and is scared and overwhelmed. The school says they have to let the boys attend school since they are innocent until proven guilty.

This is the school my daughter attends. Parents are upset because they won't release the names of the attackers. Thevictim's dad went to the local CBS station and that is how parents found out about it, 3 months later. I think the boys should be at another school until the trial. Boy, too many rights go to defendants and not the victim. Since they all ride the bus, they could very well be on my daughter's bus.

[themanintheseersuckersuit]

Two boys age 11 and 12 viciously attacked and raped another student age 11, at his home on Nov. 11. The two boys will have a trial in juvenile court, but the date has not been released. Meanwhile those 2 boys are allowed to ride the bus and attend classes with the victim. The boy's father is outraged saying his son has to see these attackers every day and is scared and overwhelmed. The school says they have to let the boys attend school since they are innocent until proven guilty.

This is the school my daughter attends. Parents are upset because they won't release the names of the attackers. Thevictim's dad went to the local CBS station and that is how parents found out about it, 3 months later. I think the boys should be at another school until the trial. Boy, too many rights go to defendants and not the victim. Since they all ride the bus, they could very well be on my daughter's bus.

I am not easily outraged, but this does it for me. A boycott would be in order.

[sunflower]

I don't even know what to say about this. I'm not sure I'd want to send my kids to school anymore. I agree on the boycott, one or two days of all the concerned parents not sending their kids to school, especially with media attention, would send the school system/administration a very strong message.

[themanintheseersuckersuit]

I had to come back to this thread.

My stepson got caught at school with a single prozac tablet and was sent to Alternative School and a girl was raped and the kids stay in school?????

[sunflower]

I mean, the least the school could do is say they can't ride the bus. Maybe you have to let them attend school, but I doubt you have to let them ride the bus. I would think it would be for their protection as much as everyone else's...there are a lot of crazies out there, if I were the parents of the accused kids, I'd worry something would happen to them, I'd keep them in my sight as much as possible.

[Hotseat Or Bust!]

I had to come back to this thread.

My stepson got caught at school with a single prozac tablet and was sent to Alternative School and a girl was raped and the kids stay in school?????

I think it was a little boy who was raped.

[kayrharris]

No way I would let my kid on that bus. Your tax dollars pay for the bus to take your kids to school.
I think the parents need to get together and schedule a meeting with the school board. Call the
local TV station and make sure they are there as well. They need to do it now!

[BackInTex]

Who is running that school system? Liberals or 'right-wingers'. Don't answer. I already know.

[geoffil]

It was an 11 year old boy that was attacked. The school refuses to release any names so I don't know if he rides my daughter's bus or is in any of her classes.

Here is more info about it:
NAPERVILLE, Ill. - Here is an interesting story going on in Illinois. Back in November, an 11-year-old boy was at a friends house when two other boys, ages 11 and 12, tied him up, stripped him and then sexually assaulted him. No details on what they did exactly, but the two boys were charged with criminal sexual assault and abuse . If those details alone aren’t enough, the three boys all attend Gregory Middle School and the two boys who were charged are still being allowed to attend.

No disciplinary action has been taken against the two boys in regards to the school, and aside from them being in separate classrooms from their victim, nothing else has been done. In fact, nothing else can be done, as there is no policy that allows the school to do a thing. The parents of the victim are not just sitting on their hands and have publicly expressed their outrage, most recently at school board meeting in Aurora. “Our son has shown extreme courage in coming forward to tell us, the school and the police of these incidents,” the victim’s father said. “Think of the courage he has to muster every single day to face his attackers on the bus stop, in the halls, in the cafeteria, in the common areas. We should show similar courage.“

They were joined with more than a hundred other concerned parents. Parents who want to know how come two kids charged with a sexual assault are being allowed to continue attending school with the victim with no disciplinary actions taken. “We need to demonstrate to all students that we, as a community, have zero tolerance for aggressive, violent behavior against students or staff,” the victim’s mother said.

And therein lies the main issue with all of this. There are no guidelines for the school board to follow in this case. They have no victims’ rights policies or a policy that allows for school discipline in off-school matters. “It may be that, at some point, we would have a nexus to deal with this case in terms of school discipline,” said District 204 Attorney Jack Canna. “Right now I don’t see it. It would be, I think, a difficult situation for the school district to engage in some discipline knowing what the law tells us we can and can’t do.“ And he is right. If there is no current policy for this type of situation and they were to discipline the two kids that have been charged, you and I both know that they would have a fat, juicy lawsuit shoved down their throats.

One member of the board did announce that they had drafted a victims’ rights policy and tried to read it at the meeting, but the school board president stopped them, saying they need to discuss it privately first.

[themanintheseersuckersuit]

I had to come back to this thread.

My stepson got caught at school with a single prozac tablet and was sent to Alternative School and a girl was raped and the kids stay in school?????

I think it was a little boy who was raped.

A child was raped, there is a clear and complete loss of perspective by TPTB at the school.

[gsabc]

If there is no current policy for this type of situation and they were to discipline the two kids that have been charged, you and I both know that they would have a fat, juicy lawsuit shoved down their throats.

Not so sure about the lawsuit. If the parents were to file, THAT becomes public knowledge and by inference tells everyone who the kids are.

If the school board had any backbone at all, they'd ban the kids from the bus at minimum, institute some measures within the school to ensure that there is NO contact with the victim whatsoever and to minimize the little alleged creeps' access to others, i.e., reducing the potential for intimidation of the victim's friends, and let the parents sue to their hearts' content. Then make sure the lawsuit goes public ASAP.

[silvercamaro]

An 11-year-old and a 12-year old who commit violent, sexual acts are statistically likely to commit similar -- and worse -- antisocial acts in the future. When those two face no apparent consequences, they are even more likely to re-offend, and sooner. If anything else happens to any other child at that school while the boys are in attendance, the school administrators can expect lawsuits far beyond whatever they have imagined so far. At that, I am horrified that the officials are more worried about lawsuits than the threat of additional harm to one or more victims.

Yes, I firmly believe in the concept of "innocent until proven guilty." If the two boys have been charged, however, that does not excuse the school for doing nothing because they don't have "a written policy." The school's primary responsibility should be to protect the other students and fight any lawsuits from the families of the alleged perpetrators if and when they arise.

The school administrators are despicable cowards.

[geoffil]

That wasn't me talking about the lawsuit, it was from an article that I cut and pasted.

Silvercamaro, you are so correct. My daughter says noone she knows, knows the names of any of the boys. The superintendent is a coward. If it were his son that was the victim, maybe he would do something.

[a1mamacat]

I am stunned.



I do think, if it had been a young girl attacked, that the response by the school would have been different, and that saddens me too.

The situation we went through last year was not at that level at all, and we ended up having to home school until the end of the year.

[themanintheseersuckersuit]

Parents who want to know how come two kids charged with a sexual assault are being allowed to continue attending school with the victim with no disciplinary actions taken.

Hey OCD'er and amateur editors and moderators, is "how come" a proper substitute for "why" in a newspaper?

[sunflower]

I am stunned.



I do think, if it had been a young girl attacked, that the response by the school would have been different, and that saddens me too.

The situation we went through last year was not at that level at all, and we ended up having to home school until the end of the year.

That's exactly what I was thinking, if this was a girl, I think that people would react in a different way.

[Appa23]

I am stunned.



I do think, if it had been a young girl attacked, that the response by the school would have been different, and that saddens me too.

The situation we went through last year was not at that level at all, and we ended up having to home school until the end of the year.

This is the issue faced by school districts all over this country. Can we take disciplinary action for wrongdoing that does not occur at school? (Saucy, I was under the impression that your son's indiscretion happened at school.) For example, if a bunch of students have a kegger over the weekend and get picked up for MIP, can the Principal suspend them from school? In the couple of years that I represented a school district, it was a legal concern, and this was over 12 years ago.

It sounds like a fine idea until it is your kid who has the "permanant mark" on their school record because he did something crazy one weekend. (Yes, the alleged events described by Geoffil go way past "crazy hijinks", but you have to have a consistent rule for all out-of-school issues.) In addition, the disciplinary hearing would have to go before the actual criminal/juvenile hearing, which could have some negative effects on the latter proceeding.

It is clear that one can be "suspended" from extracurricular activities based on criminal violations that occur outside of the school setting, as that is a standard clause to which the parents and student agree when they "sign up."

I do wonder if the school district tried to discuss a change in school with the parents of the accused, selling it as a win-win. I also am surprised that the names have not come out, as only a few people are bound to not disclosing the names.

[nitrah55]

Taking the accused kids off the bus will not placate the parents who will then ask, "Why weren't they suspended?" So, if the school board is not prepared to suspend the kids, the board isn't going to take them off the bus.

[peacock2121]

This is just plain screwed up.

How can the parents of the accused kids not being doing something - never mind. I know.

I was sexually molested on the school bus in the 1970's. No one was even suspended. I thought we had grown.

This makes me crazy.

[a1mamacat]

I am stunned.



I do think, if it had been a young girl attacked, that the response by the school would have been different, and that saddens me too.

The situation we went through last year was not at that level at all, and we ended up having to home school until the end of the year.

This is the issue faced by school districts all over this country. Can we take disciplinary action for wrongdoing that does not occur at school? (Saucy, I was under the impression that your son's indiscretion happened at school.) For example, if a bunch of students have a kegger over the weekend and get picked up for MIP, can the Principal suspend them from school? In the couple of years that I represented a school district, it was a legal concern, and this was over 12 years ago.

It sounds like a fine idea until it is your kid who has the "permanant mark" on their school record because he did something crazy one weekend. (Yes, the alleged events described by Geoffil go way past "crazy hijinks", but you have to have a consistent rule for all out-of-school issues.) In addition, the disciplinary hearing would have to go before the actual criminal/juvenile hearing, which could have some negative effects on the latter proceeding.

It is clear that one can be "suspended" from extracurricular activities based on criminal violations that occur outside of the school setting, as that is a standard clause to which the parents and student agree when they "sign up."

I do wonder if the school district tried to discuss a change in school with the parents of the accused, selling it as a win-win. I also am surprised that the names have not come out, as only a few people are bound to not disclosing the names.

Nope, it was out of school. The issue with the school board was the possible risk if he was bullied at school, and what the response might be then, so they erred on the side of caution for the majority.

[Appa23]

I am stunned.



I do think, if it had been a young girl attacked, that the response by the school would have been different, and that saddens me too.

The situation we went through last year was not at that level at all, and we ended up having to home school until the end of the year.

This is the issue faced by school districts all over this country. Can we take disciplinary action for wrongdoing that does not occur at school? (Saucy, I was under the impression that your son's indiscretion happened at school.) For example, if a bunch of students have a kegger over the weekend and get picked up for MIP, can the Principal suspend them from school? In the couple of years that I represented a school district, it was a legal concern, and this was over 12 years ago.

It sounds like a fine idea until it is your kid who has the "permanant mark" on their school record because he did something crazy one weekend. (Yes, the alleged events described by Geoffil go way past "crazy hijinks", but you have to have a consistent rule for all out-of-school issues.) In addition, the disciplinary hearing would have to go before the actual criminal/juvenile hearing, which could have some negative effects on the latter proceeding.

It is clear that one can be "suspended" from extracurricular activities based on criminal violations that occur outside of the school setting, as that is a standard clause to which the parents and student agree when they "sign up."

I do wonder if the school district tried to discuss a change in school with the parents of the accused, selling it as a win-win. I also am surprised that the names have not come out, as only a few people are bound to not disclosing the names.

Nope, it was out of school. The issue with the school board was the possible risk if he was bullied at school, and what the response might be then, so they erred on the side of caution for the majority.

OK. "Clearly, my memory or reading comprehension is terrible. (I now am wondering why would be be bullied at school for something not done at school, but it is more of a question that does not need a response. I'll chalk it up to teenage issues that I have not yet experienced)

Shows the difference in the two countries.

If a school district is going to hold a suspension/expulsion hearing here, then it better be able to show exactly where in the school rules & regulations where the infraction fits. I do not recall seeing "misbehavior outside of school setting" in our district's handbook.

[trevor_macfee]

At this point, it appears that the offense, as horrifying as it is, is only alleged. So I don't see how the school can take any "disciplinary action" against the alleged perpetrators whether there is any policy regarding off-campus offenses or not.

However, a school's primary job has to be keeping its students safe. How can children learn if they are not safe? In fact, I would go farther - a school has to establish not just actual safety but also the perception of safety in order for learning to take place.

There is no way that actual or perceived safety can be assured with these alleged perpetrators at school. Rather than removing them with a "disciplinary action," it would seem to make sense to offer them (their parents) alternatives for their education, either tutoring at home or in another school setting.

If I were a parent of a student at that school, I would most certainly want the alleged perpetrators off the bus and out of the building. It would seem that this could be accomplished without jumping to any conclusions about their guilt or innocence, or making any disciplinary marks on their "permanent records."

Then let the legal system run its course.

[mrkelley23]

Interesting.

Several things jumped out at me in this thread.

First and foremost, the alleged activities occurred away from school, presumably at a private home, and yet all the outrage is directed at the school. The alleged crime was months ago, and yet the school is the villain for not taking disciplinary action when it doesn't have any of the facts in its possession. It's not like the school is allowed to subpoena the court records, the kids, the parents, or anything else. Where is the outrage at a juvenile court system that takes months to do anything at all? Where is the outrage at parents who allowed this type of activity to take place in their home, presumably without supervision?

Second, geoffil refers to the crime as a "rape," while the only factual story (presumably, since there isn't a cite) refers to it as a sexual assault. There is a difference, both in law and in fact. While there is extreme emotional damage in both, is this closer to the crime of rape, or to the taping of butt cheeks together with duct tape? As Geoffil herself admits, nobody really knows anything yet.

Third, while my school has taken action against students for off-campus activities (a gang-related assault in one, drinking and drug use in another) they have taken major heat for it, and the students were much older, so they didn't have to deal with juvenile authorities, who are some of the most frustrating people our administrators have to deal with. I had a kid in class several years ago who, by the age of 17, had several crimes of violence on his record, and yet our lovely juvenile judge kept sending him back to school because "that's the best place for him."

All in all, I would want much, much more information than what is here before I would rush to any sort of judgment. And if my child were the victim of a crime as sordid as the one described, and the other parents insisted on protecting their child's "rights," I would be taking advantage of the transfer rules that are the only good thing I see in the federal No Child Left Behind act. Yes, the guilty ones should be the ones who have to pay a price, but if the judicial system is that slow, and that faulty, then I would rather my child be safe and healthy. At least, as much as possible.

[TheCalvinator24]

I can only speak as to things in Texas, but here, there is no such offense as "rape" any more. What used to be called "rape" is now termed "sexual assault." Taping another's butt cheeks together would not be "sexual assault." It would simply be "assault."

I looked up the Illinois law. "Criminal sexual assault" requires penetration, so despite the fact that the term is no longer used in most states legal codes, I would say "rape" is an accurate word.

[mrkelley23]

It appears my sketchy knowledge of the law has become even sketchier with the passage of time. My apologies, especially to geoffil, who certainly knows more about the situation than I do.