What, exactly, is a RINO?

[Bob78164]

And there are countless Republicans who are plenty swampy who would not be considered to be RINOs because they have bent the knee to Trump, even if at one time they were “never Trumpers” before cowering.

One of those is now running for Vice President. --Bob

[flockofseagulls104]

And there are countless Republicans who are plenty swampy who would not be considered to be RINOs because they have bent the knee to Trump, even if at one time they were “never Trumpers” before cowering.

One of those is now running for Vice President. --Bob

Yeah, booby. A lot of us didn't trust or like trump when he ran in 2016. Including me and J.D. Vance. It is what he accomplished, even despite constant sabotage and bullshit attacks from your comrades, (that continue to this day) that convinced us to support him.

It is telling that you are a part of our 'justice' system using stupid arguments like this. No wonder very few people have any confidence in it anymore.

[tlynn78]

It's adorable how the same people completely discounting the VP for prez, and some of whom wanted her dumped from even the VP position on the ticket just weeks ago, have 180'd, but can't seem to grasp that others might change their perceptions of Trump based on his 4 years in office.

[BackInTex]

It's adorable how the same people completely discounting the VP for prez, and some of whom wanted her dumped from even the VP position on the ticket just weeks ago, have 180'd, but can't seem to grasp that others might change their perceptions of Trump based on his 4 years in office.

You forgot to [mic drop].

[earendel]

I don't know a thing about Ryan Walters. And I sincerely doubt you do either. But I think it shows a desperation in defending your specious argument that you'd cite this obscure incident as confirming your ignorant narrative. You have the correct answer. And it's my FINAL ANSWER. And I didn't have to phone a friend for it.

As a matter of fact I know a great deal about Ryan Waters. I'm from Oklahoma and although I no longer live there I have friends who do and I keep tabs on what's happening. The incident in question involves Walters' refusal to allow GOP legislators to attend meetings, refuses to comply with requests for basic information such as where he is allocating funding for education. He's called them "clowns" and "liars", and, worst of all, RINOs. So it seems that it all depends upon whose ox (or RINO ) is gored.

And I hope you're celebrating, because today in history the "swamp" took its biggest hit - the British invaded Washington D.C. and burned the White House and the Capitol.

[flockofseagulls104]

I don't know a thing about Ryan Walters. And I sincerely doubt you do either. But I think it shows a desperation in defending your specious argument that you'd cite this obscure incident as confirming your ignorant narrative. You have the correct answer. And it's my FINAL ANSWER. And I didn't have to phone a friend for it.

As a matter of fact I know a great deal about Ryan Waters. I'm from Oklahoma and although I no longer live there I have friends who do and I keep tabs on what's happening. The incident in question involves Walters' refusal to allow GOP legislators to attend meetings, refuses to comply with requests for basic information such as where he is allocating funding for education. He's called them "clowns" and "liars", and, worst of all, RINOs. So it seems that it all depends upon whose ox (or RINO ) is gored.

And I hope you're celebrating, because today in history the "swamp" took its biggest hit - the British invaded Washington D.C. and burned the White House and the Capitol.

Yes, but in your case it is definitely skewed because of you and your friends decidedly biased viewpoint. And frankly, why in the world should you care what a RINO is or is not? What is it that you are trying to prove? More TDS bullshit? I've explained what the accepted definition is within the party I've joined, mostly because I'm sick of the people who get elected proclaiming values and platforms that they completely abandon when it counts once they get elected. Though we in the republican party are now very much united against the existential threat to our country posed by the current democrats, our internal battle is to rid ourselves of those who sell out to the opposition on important issues, and are cowards when faced with taking a stand. Witness Kevin McCarthy. Liz Cheney. Adam Kinzinger. I don't care what their 'conservative' credentials are. (And BTW, it is not for someone like you to judge that.) When they bail out on the most important issues, they are republican in name only. You want to see what RINOs are? Look at the Lincoln Project. So called 'republicans' who are doing everything they can to not only sabotage the preferred (and actually elected, as opposed to your candidate, who was decided on in smoke-filled back rooms) Presidential candidate of 'their' party, but savage the reputation of the party as a whole.

[Weyoun]

And there are countless Republicans who are plenty swampy who would not be considered to be RINOs because they have bent the knee to Trump, even if at one time they were “never Trumpers” before cowering.

One of those is now running for Vice President. --Bob

Yeah, booby. A lot of us didn't trust or like trump when he ran in 2016. Including me and J.D. Vance. It is what he accomplished, even despite constant sabotage and bullshit attacks from your comrades, (that continue to this day) that convinced us to support him.

It is telling that you are a part of our 'justice' system using stupid arguments like this. No wonder very few people have any confidence in it anymore.

It is weird how he thought Trump was so great at the same time it was politically convenient and financially beneficial for him to do so. It’s almost like he’s a politician who will do whatever he can to make his own bank account bigger, which I believe is one reasonable definition for a member of the swamp

[Weyoun]

It's adorable how the same people completely discounting the VP for prez, and some of whom wanted her dumped from even the VP position on the ticket just weeks ago, have 180'd, but can't seem to grasp that others might change their perceptions of Trump based on his 4 years in office.

I think it’s because Vance was at one point ranting against the predatory capitalism that Trump represents, only to join the guy recently. Even up to his run up to Ohio Senate race, he initially was lukewarm about Trump, and vice versa, before working out an endorsement. That was basically two years ago.

He’s always been about himself.

[Beebs52]

It's adorable how the same people completely discounting the VP for prez, and some of whom wanted her dumped from even the VP position on the ticket just weeks ago, have 180'd, but can't seem to grasp that others might change their perceptions of Trump based on his 4 years in office.

I think it’s because Vance was at one point ranting against the predatory capitalism that Trump represents, only to join the guy recently. Even up to his run up to Ohio Senate race, he initially was lukewarm about Trump, and vice versa, before working out an endorsement. That was basically two years ago.

He’s always been about himself.

That is a truly upchuckle-inducing statement. What politician, from local on up isn't "about himself OR herself"? Do you truly think there are complete alltruists out there running?

And, predatory capitalism? What?

[earendel]

Yes, but in your case it is definitely skewed because of you and your friends decidedly biased viewpoint.

The statements are from Walters' own lips.

And frankly, why in the world should you care what a RINO is or is not? What is it that you are trying to prove? More TDS bullshit?

I'm just curious because that term gets bandied about (as illustrated by Walters' statements) and seems to be used to describe anyone with whom you happen to be in disagreement. That's fine.

I've explained what the accepted definition is within the party I've joined, mostly because I'm sick of the people who get elected proclaiming values and platforms that they completely abandon when it counts once they get elected. Though we in the republican party are now very much united against the existential threat to our country posed by the current democrats, our internal battle is to rid ourselves of those who sell out to the opposition on important issues, and are cowards when faced with taking a stand. Witness Kevin McCarthy. Liz Cheney. Adam Kinzinger. I don't care what their 'conservative' credentials are. (And BTW, it is not for someone like you to judge that.)

I'm not the one who is judging their conservative credentials. Their voting records were 90%+ conservative. Until they decided to go against Trump. Then their voting records didn't matter.

When they bail out on the most important issues, they are republican in name only. You want to see what RINOs are? Look at the Lincoln Project. So called 'republicans' who are doing everything they can to not only sabotage the preferred (and actually elected, as opposed to your candidate, who was decided on in smoke-filled back rooms) Presidential candidate of 'their' party, but savage the reputation of the party as a whole.

Perhaps I'm asking the wrong question. What are the "important issues" that Cheney, et. al. bail out on, other than not wanting to re-elect Trump? Is it the border? Is it the economy?

[flockofseagulls104]

One of those is now running for Vice President. --Bob

Yeah, booby. A lot of us didn't trust or like trump when he ran in 2016. Including me and J.D. Vance. It is what he accomplished, even despite constant sabotage and bullshit attacks from your comrades, (that continue to this day) that convinced us to support him.

It is telling that you are a part of our 'justice' system using stupid arguments like this. No wonder very few people have any confidence in it anymore.

It is weird how he thought Trump was so great at the same time it was politically convenient and financially beneficial for him to do so. It’s almost like he’s a politician who will do whatever he can to make his own bank account bigger, which I believe is one reasonable definition for a member of the swamp

I think if you were capable of doing a similar objective evaluation of any of the leaders of your party, you would leave that party in an instant. But you're not.

[flockofseagulls104]

Yes, but in your case it is definitely skewed because of you and your friends decidedly biased viewpoint.

The statements are from Walters' own lips.

And frankly, why in the world should you care what a RINO is or is not? What is it that you are trying to prove? More TDS bullshit?

I'm just curious because that term gets bandied about (as illustrated by Walters' statements) and seems to be used to describe anyone with whom you happen to be in disagreement. That's fine.

I've explained what the accepted definition is within the party I've joined, mostly because I'm sick of the people who get elected proclaiming values and platforms that they completely abandon when it counts once they get elected. Though we in the republican party are now very much united against the existential threat to our country posed by the current democrats, our internal battle is to rid ourselves of those who sell out to the opposition on important issues, and are cowards when faced with taking a stand. Witness Kevin McCarthy. Liz Cheney. Adam Kinzinger. I don't care what their 'conservative' credentials are. (And BTW, it is not for someone like you to judge that.)

I'm not the one who is judging their conservative credentials. Their voting records were 90%+ conservative. Until they decided to go against Trump. Then their voting records didn't matter.

When they bail out on the most important issues, they are republican in name only. You want to see what RINOs are? Look at the Lincoln Project. So called 'republicans' who are doing everything they can to not only sabotage the preferred (and actually elected, as opposed to your candidate, who was decided on in smoke-filled back rooms) Presidential candidate of 'their' party, but savage the reputation of the party as a whole.

Perhaps I'm asking the wrong question. What are the "important issues" that Cheney, et. al. bail out on, other than not wanting to re-elect Trump? Is it the border? Is it the economy?

When you were presenting yourself as a reasonable 'independent', I thought it might be worthwhile to engage in reasoned debate with you. Not so much anymore. I have explained to you that it's not about trump alone. But you don't seem to accept that. McCarthy's out because he went along with the dems and the swamp with the continuing resolution crap. Had nothing to do with trump. Did not have the cajones to stand up for the party's values when push came to shove. Then he resigned in a way to give the opposition more power, as did Mike Gallagher. But I'm not going to convince you. You are just as partisan as the long term lefties on this bored.. And seem to have just as much of a case of TDS. Congrats.

[Beebs52]

Sorry if this is a repeat. Thought it posted.
Hey Ear. I think you've always been more centrist than anything. Who you gonna vote for? Baiting and debating is just an intellectual exercise.

[earendel]

When you were presenting yourself as a reasonable 'independent', I thought it might be worthwhile to engage in reasoned debate with you. Not so much anymore. I have explained to you that it's not about trump alone. But you don't seem to accept that. McCarthy's out because he went along with the dems and the swamp with the continuing resolution crap. Had nothing to do with trump. Did not have the cajones to stand up for the party's values when push came to shove. Then he resigned in a way to give the opposition more power, as did Mike Gallagher. But I'm not going to convince you. You are just as partisan as the long term lefties on this bored.. And seem to have just as much of a case of TDS. Congrats.

FWIW I happen to agree with you regarding McCarthy. His downfall was of his own making. It's the others I've mentioned whose attitude toward Trump got them branded as RINOs. It certainly couldn't be because of their voting records, because they voted with the GOP a vast majority of the times. Also FWIW I'm not "in the tank" for Harris, either. I don't agree with some of her pronouncements (price gouging, for instance).

[earendel]

Sorry if this is a repeat. Thought it posted.
Hey Ear. I think you've always been more centrist than anything. Who you gonna vote for? Baiting and debating is just an intellectual exercise.

Probably Harris, but I'm still waiting to see her put some substance to her "politics of joy". As it stands, she's more in line with my values than Trump.

[flockofseagulls104]

Sorry if this is a repeat. Thought it posted.
Hey Ear. I think you've always been more centrist than anything. Who you gonna vote for? Baiting and debating is just an intellectual exercise.

Probably Harris, but I'm still waiting to see her put some substance to her "politics of joy". As it stands, she's more in line with my values than Trump.

What do you know about her values, ear? Aside from the remaking of Kamala campaign we're all being subjected to.
What specific values does she share with you? And show some concrete proof that she has shown any support for those values in the past. At least before a month ago.

Are you really a closet San Francisco radical leftist?

[Weyoun]

Sorry if this is a repeat. Thought it posted.
Hey Ear. I think you've always been more centrist than anything. Who you gonna vote for? Baiting and debating is just an intellectual exercise.

Probably Harris, but I'm still waiting to see her put some substance to her "politics of joy". As it stands, she's more in line with my values than Trump.

What do you know about her values, ear? Aside from the remaking of Kamala campaign we're all being subjected to.
What specific values does she share with you? And show some concrete proof that she has shown any support for those values in the past. At least before a month ago.

Are you really a closet San Francisco radical leftist?

I don’t wanna speak for him, but perhaps his values are far more basic, such as “not being deliberately cruel to your fellow human being” or “I think the Earth goes around the sun.”

[flockofseagulls104]

Probably Harris, but I'm still waiting to see her put some substance to her "politics of joy". As it stands, she's more in line with my values than Trump.

What do you know about her values, ear? Aside from the remaking of Kamala campaign we're all being subjected to.
What specific values does she share with you? And show some concrete proof that she has shown any support for those values in the past. At least before a month ago.

Are you really a closet San Francisco radical leftist?

I don’t wanna speak for him, but perhaps his values are far more basic, such as “not being deliberately cruel to your fellow human being” or “I think the Earth goes around the sun.”

You do enough damage speaking for yourself. Since you have been so nice to me, adding several entries into my signature, I think you have provided enough evidence to qualify for the title of complete and utter idiot.

[earendel]

Sorry if this is a repeat. Thought it posted.
Hey Ear. I think you've always been more centrist than anything. Who you gonna vote for? Baiting and debating is just an intellectual exercise.

Probably Harris, but I'm still waiting to see her put some substance to her "politics of joy". As it stands, she's more in line with my values than Trump.

What do you know about her values, ear? Aside from the remaking of Kamala campaign we're all being subjected to.
What specific values does she share with you? And show some concrete proof that she has shown any support for those values in the past. At least before a month ago.

Are you really a closet San Francisco radical leftist?

You got me, flock. I'm a flaming liberal - I'm so liberal I make Bernie Sanders and the Squad look like fascists.
As for values, how about the sanctity of marriage? To my knowledge Harris hasn't committed adultery, hasn't been involved with a porn star, hasn't been accused of raping someone, hasn't bragged about grabbing men by their genitals, hasn't branded immigrants as "rapists and murderers" being released from foreign prisons, hasn't cozied up to autocratic leaders, hasn't resorted to childish name-calling. Harris has expressed concern for the suffering of Palestinians and immigrants. I'm sure that when she finally gets around to concrete proposals for what she would do in office there will be places where I disagree. But in the end, I believe I have to make a moral choice. And, as I have said, I live in a state where my Harris vote won't matter.

[tlynn78]

Probably Harris, but I'm still waiting to see her put some substance to her "politics of joy". As it stands, she's more in line with my values than Trump.

What do you know about her values, ear? Aside from the remaking of Kamala campaign we're all being subjected to.
What specific values does she share with you? And show some concrete proof that she has shown any support for those values in the past. At least before a month ago.

Are you really a closet San Francisco radical leftist?

You got me, flock. I'm a flaming liberal - I'm so liberal I make Bernie Sanders and the Squad look like fascists.
As for values, how about the sanctity of marriage? To my knowledge Harris hasn't committed adultery, hasn't been involved with a porn star, hasn't been accused of raping someone, hasn't bragged about grabbing men by their genitals, hasn't branded immigrants as "rapists and murderers" being released from foreign prisons, hasn't cozied up to autocratic leaders, hasn't resorted to childish name-calling. Harris has expressed concern for the suffering of Palestinians and immigrants. I'm sure that when she finally gets around to concrete proposals for what she would do in office there will be places where I disagree. But in the end, I believe I have to make a moral choice. And, as I have said, I live in a state where my Harris vote won't matter.

Willie Brown. Bless your heart.

[Bob78164]

Willie Brown. Bless your heart.

Why do you have a problem with someone dating a guy who, at the time, had been separated from his wife and living apart from her for approximately a decade?

That's about the same length of time, by the way, my sister was separated and lived apart from her husband. They stayed married so he could remain on her insurance. They finalized their divorce when my sister was ready to marry her current husband. --Bob

[Beebs52]

Willie Brown. Bless your heart.

Why do you have a problem with someone dating a guy who, at the time, had been separated from his wife and living apart from her for approximately a decade?

That's about the same length of time, by the way, my sister was separated and lived apart from her husband. They stayed married so he could remain on her insurance. They finalized their divorce when my sister was ready to marry her current husband. --Bob

Because if you're going to excuse others for adultery ,or unbecoming activities, you best be certain you have facts straight and not be wishy washy because of the politics of your candidate.
Staying married to keep insurance is rather bullshit.

[Bob78164]

Willie Brown. Bless your heart.

Why do you have a problem with someone dating a guy who, at the time, had been separated from his wife and living apart from her for approximately a decade?

That's about the same length of time, by the way, my sister was separated and lived apart from her husband. They stayed married so he could remain on her insurance. They finalized their divorce when my sister was ready to marry her current husband. --Bob

Because if you're going to excuse others for adultery ,or unbecoming activities, you best be certain you have facts straight and not be wishy washy because of the politics of your candidate.
Staying married to keep insurance is rather bullshit.

So you think my sister should have left the father of her child without insurance because, why? Admittedly this is less of an issue now thanks to the Affordable Care Act (passed without a single Republican vote), but that didn't exist yet.

I'm not the least bit wishy washy about this issue. I generally don't care about the private lives of candidates, as long as they don't campaign on them or support government regulating private and consensual conduct. I will point out, though, that it was Donny who disregarded his own marriage vows.

There's no evidence that Ms. Harris (then a private citizen) cheated on anyone. Any issue with Brown's marriage is between him and his then-wife, and is not her problem. By all accounts, Brown's wife had no issue with what he was doing, so everyone else should (in the words of Governor Walz) "mind their own damn business." --Bob

[Beebs52]

Why do you have a problem with someone dating a guy who, at the time, had been separated from his wife and living apart from her for approximately a decade?

That's about the same length of time, by the way, my sister was separated and lived apart from her husband. They stayed married so he could remain on her insurance. They finalized their divorce when my sister was ready to marry her current husband. --Bob

Because if you're going to excuse others for adultery ,or unbecoming activities, you best be certain you have facts straight and not be wishy washy because of the politics of your candidate.
Staying married to keep insurance is rather bullshit.

So you think my sister should have left the father of her child without insurance because, why? Admittedly this is less of an issue now thanks to the Affordable Care Act (passed without a single Republican vote), but that didn't exist yet.

I'm not the least bit wishy washy about this issue. I generally don't care about the private lives of candidates, as long as they don't campaign on them or support government regulating private and consensual conduct. I will point out, though, that it was Donny who disregarded his own marriage vows.

There's no evidence that Ms. Harris (then a private citizen) cheated on anyone. Any issue with Brown's marriage is between him and his then-wife, and is not her problem. By all accounts, Brown's wife had no issue with what he was doing, so everyone else should (in the words of Governor Walz) "mind their own damn business." --Bob
Brown was still married, so if ya wanna get technical it was cheating. I don't care cause she/they worm their way about definitions.
As, it seems, your sis might have? Why wasn't her ex husband on his own insurance to begin with?
Hmm?

[flockofseagulls104]

Because if you're going to excuse others for adultery ,or unbecoming activities, you best be certain you have facts straight and not be wishy washy because of the politics of your candidate.
Staying married to keep insurance is rather bullshit.

So you think my sister should have left the father of her child without insurance because, why? Admittedly this is less of an issue now thanks to the Affordable Care Act (passed without a single Republican vote), but that didn't exist yet.

I'm not the least bit wishy washy about this issue. I generally don't care about the private lives of candidates, as long as they don't campaign on them or support government regulating private and consensual conduct. I will point out, though, that it was Donny who disregarded his own marriage vows.

There's no evidence that Ms. Harris (then a private citizen) cheated on anyone. Any issue with Brown's marriage is between him and his then-wife, and is not her problem. By all accounts, Brown's wife had no issue with what he was doing, so everyone else should (in the words of Governor Walz) "mind their own damn business." --Bob
Brown was still married, so if ya wanna get technical it was cheating. I don't care cause she/they worm their way about definitions.
As, it seems, your sis might have? Why wasn't her ex husband on his own insurance to begin with?
Hmm?

Of course. It's to be expected. Appoint your girlfriend or boyfriend to important positions. Just like Fani Willis and Nathan Wade.