"Whatever the hell they want" to NATO

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Weyoun
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Re: "Whatever the hell they want" to NATO

#76 Post by Weyoun » Tue Feb 20, 2024 6:29 pm

flockofseagulls104 wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2024 6:22 pm
So, our response to Navalny is we are going to impose 'very strong sanctions'!

Excuse me, didn't we do that already? I think biden believes everyone's memory is as bad as his. I thought our previous sanctions would bring Russia to its knees and stop them from waging war and bring it to an end quickly? Somehow, I deduce that didn't quite work.

I want the war to end, I want no more people on either side to die, and I want a peaceful solution that keeps Ukraine a sovereign nation. But I do not agree with giving them endless money. That hasn't stopped the war thus far, and I don't see how it will lead to any end, except more people being killed. Your solution is to have it go on until Russia gets tired of it? Using OUR money, which we have to borrow from other countries that hate us? What about the innocent people who will be casualties until that ever happens? You are so willing to question my, and Spock's and whoever's humanity. Where the fuck is yours, doc?
I think what's galling is that you support Russia rolling over the Ukraine, because you think fewer people will die that way. Hardly clear, especially if it leads to a broader European war. You do not care about individual Ukrainians one whit, or you would want Russian invading and sacking their country. I am sure some young woman raped by a Russian soldier will console herself thinking, "well, at least they haven't killed me yet, and flock can sleep better at night."

And Ukraine does need the resources, including money. Failure to do so will guarantee that above. That will give a victory to Russia, and its friends China and Iran. This isn't a domino theory theoretical - that war is happening RIGHT now.

It is interesting how uncreative you are. WHATEVER Trump supports, you invariably support, too.

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Re: "Whatever the hell they want" to NATO

#77 Post by flockofseagulls104 » Tue Feb 20, 2024 7:52 pm

I think what's galling is that you support Russia rolling over the Ukraine, because you think fewer people will die that way.
Please inform me where exactly I said that other than your imagination. You need to lay off the alcohol.
And Ukraine does need the resources, including money. Failure to do so will guarantee that above. That will give a victory to Russia, and its friends China and Iran. This isn't a domino theory theoretical - that war is happening RIGHT now.
If it's that serious to our interests, why aren't we more involved other than giving them money to buy our weapons? Why aren't we doing ANYTHING to put an end to it? Seems like we're only in it for the profit.

Meanwhile, we are ignoring the direct threats from those other countries because of the weakness of this administration. Increasing numbers of Chinese and Middle Eastern people are entering our country through our southern non-border, China has infiltrated our government (Swalwell, Pelosi as examples), is hacking us and probably knows more about us than we do, surveilling us seemingly at will and buying land adjacent to our military bases. This administration has provided Iran the funds to finance increasing terrorist attacks and is hindering our only ally in the region from doing what they need to do to protect themselves.

For some reason, you seem to forget that the Trump Administration was at the cusp of having Saudi Arabia and Israel sign on to the Abraham Accords. Then the biden administration dropped that and gave Iran the funding it needed to restart its terrorism. Saudi Arabia does not trust us anymore, for good reason. It is because of that recklessness and weakness we are where we are today.

I don't know what plan Trump has. Neither do you. Amazingly, none of this kind of stuff happened when he was President. China was contained and saw some pushback on its behavior. Iran was close to being completely bankrupt and vulnerable to a citizen uprising. Russia didn't invade anybody. Several countries made peace with Israel. Isis was defeated rather easily because we DID something. I don't know what his plans are. But it has to be better than what is going on now.
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Re: "Whatever the hell they want" to NATO

#78 Post by silverscreenselect » Tue Feb 20, 2024 8:38 pm

flockofseagulls104 wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2024 7:52 pm
If it's that serious to our interests, why aren't we more involved other than giving them money to buy our weapons? Why aren't we doing ANYTHING to put an end to it? Seems like we're only in it for the profit.
We can't "put an end to it" because Putin has no interest in putting an end to it unless and until he controls Ukraine. Right now, his best strategy is to wait until the election when he figures Trump will put an end to it by cutting off aid totally and letting Ukraine get run over followed by some "peace in our time" assurances from Putin that he has no other territorial aspirations.
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Re: "Whatever the hell they want" to NATO

#79 Post by silverscreenselect » Tue Feb 20, 2024 8:42 pm

flockofseagulls104 wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2024 6:22 pm
But I do not agree with giving them endless money. That hasn't stopped the war thus far, and I don't see how it will lead to any end, except more people being killed.
You realize that if we and our allies hadn't given them money and weapons, the war would have ended, and the Russian flag would have been flying over Kyiv months ago. Putin has no interest in a negotiated peace, which, even if he agrees to something similar to what happened in 2014, would end the same way, with him launching a new attack when he'd regrouped and rearmed his forces.
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Re: "Whatever the hell they want" to NATO

#80 Post by Beebs52 » Tue Feb 20, 2024 8:45 pm

Serious question. Why is there such a stagnation in that war now? Not trying to be ugly.
Well, then

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Re: "Whatever the hell they want" to NATO

#81 Post by flockofseagulls104 » Tue Feb 20, 2024 9:33 pm

silverscreenselect wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2024 8:42 pm
flockofseagulls104 wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2024 6:22 pm
But I do not agree with giving them endless money. That hasn't stopped the war thus far, and I don't see how it will lead to any end, except more people being killed.
You realize that if we and our allies hadn't given them money and weapons, the war would have ended, and the Russian flag would have been flying over Kyiv months ago. Putin has no interest in a negotiated peace, which, even if he agrees to something similar to what happened in 2014, would end the same way, with him launching a new attack when he'd regrouped and rearmed his forces.
If you want to go the speculation route, why not admit that if Trump was President, there wouldn't have been a war.

Well, how about we do something to end it, instead of keeping it fueled? Like use our power and influence, if we still have any, to demand a ceasefire and get an agreement both sides can live with. Hmm. We're all for a ceasefire in Israel when it's a matter of their survival both as a nation and a population.
Last edited by flockofseagulls104 on Tue Feb 20, 2024 9:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: "Whatever the hell they want" to NATO

#82 Post by flockofseagulls104 » Tue Feb 20, 2024 9:34 pm

Beebs52 wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2024 8:45 pm
Serious question. Why is there such a stagnation in that war now? Not trying to be ugly.
My opinion. On our side it's good for the Military Industrial Complex.
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Re: "Whatever the hell they want" to NATO

#83 Post by flockofseagulls104 » Tue Feb 20, 2024 9:52 pm

It is interesting how uncreative you are. WHATEVER Trump supports, you invariably support, too.
You know what, doc? You convinced me. I am just so uncreative. I am going to switch. I am not going to support everything Trump supports anymore. I'm gonna go with Sarah Sanders instead. How's that? Am I more creative now?
“Because we have a president who absolutely doesn’t care that millions and millions of people are coming across our border illegally. He has the power to shut the border down, to stop it. He can reinstate the remain in Mexico policy. He could actually build the wall. There is a lot of things he could be doing and this simply is a complete and total failure by this administration. In the state of Arkansas alone we seized enough fentanyl in the last year to kill every single person in our entire state,” Sanders began.

“That’s nearly 3 million people. Every man, woman and child. Enough fentanyl just in this state alone. It’s an absolute disgrace with this president is doing and it’s another great example while in November he has to go and Donald Trump has to be put back in place so we can secure our border and get our country back,” she added.

Watters jumped in and asked: “Do think Joe Biden loves this country?”

“If he did, he certainly wouldn’t be trying to destroy it second by second, minute by minute, hour by hour. That’s exactly what he’s doing. He’s allowed our economy to drop and our border to completely collapse. Our enemy certainly don’t fear us,” Sanders said.

She added: “Our allies don’t respect us. Literally every single thing he does is at the destruction and demise of the people in this country. I think it is frankly totally disgraceful and disqualifying for him to be president of the United States if he cannot do the simple job of securing our border either at the south or the north.
So remember that. doc. Don't accuse me of being a Trump supporter ever again. I'm with Sarah!
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Re: "Whatever the hell they want" to NATO

#84 Post by silverscreenselect » Tue Feb 20, 2024 10:23 pm

flockofseagulls104 wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2024 9:34 pm
Beebs52 wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2024 8:45 pm
Serious question. Why is there such a stagnation in that war now? Not trying to be ugly.
My opinion. On our side it's good for the Military Industrial Complex.
The Military Industrial Complex did not install the thousands of mines and other defense armaments that the Russians have assembled along their front lines. The Russians also have a plan of "attack" that depends on sending vast amounts of troops towards Ukrainian positions in the hopes that the Ukrainians will run out of ammunition to repel them. Usually it doesn't work. Sometimes it does. The Russians have lost about 80-90% of the force with which they originally invaded Ukraine. They are suffering hundreds of casualties every day. They've made up the difference so far with reserves, convict and conscript labor, and new recruits.
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Re: "Whatever the hell they want" to NATO

#85 Post by Weyoun » Tue Feb 20, 2024 10:57 pm

Yeah I am trying to think how Lockheed Martin is making money in Russia right now, but I am sure flock has some lurid theory

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Re: "Whatever the hell they want" to NATO

#86 Post by Weyoun » Tue Feb 20, 2024 10:58 pm

flockofseagulls104 wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2024 9:52 pm
It is interesting how uncreative you are. WHATEVER Trump supports, you invariably support, too.
You know what, doc? You convinced me. I am just so uncreative. I am going to switch. I am not going to support everything Trump supports anymore. I'm gonna go with Sarah Sanders instead. How's that? Am I more creative now?
“Because we have a president who absolutely doesn’t care that millions and millions of people are coming across our border illegally. He has the power to shut the border down, to stop it. He can reinstate the remain in Mexico policy. He could actually build the wall. There is a lot of things he could be doing and this simply is a complete and total failure by this administration. In the state of Arkansas alone we seized enough fentanyl in the last year to kill every single person in our entire state,” Sanders began.

“That’s nearly 3 million people. Every man, woman and child. Enough fentanyl just in this state alone. It’s an absolute disgrace with this president is doing and it’s another great example while in November he has to go and Donald Trump has to be put back in place so we can secure our border and get our country back,” she added.

Watters jumped in and asked: “Do think Joe Biden loves this country?”

“If he did, he certainly wouldn’t be trying to destroy it second by second, minute by minute, hour by hour. That’s exactly what he’s doing. He’s allowed our economy to drop and our border to completely collapse. Our enemy certainly don’t fear us,” Sanders said.

She added: “Our allies don’t respect us. Literally every single thing he does is at the destruction and demise of the people in this country. I think it is frankly totally disgraceful and disqualifying for him to be president of the United States if he cannot do the simple job of securing our border either at the south or the north.
So remember that. doc. Don't accuse me of being a Trump supporter ever again. I'm with Sarah!
I don't think you understand that the border and Ukraine are two issues that are not mutually exclusive. I agree there needs to be better border control. Great. Next.

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Re: "Whatever the hell they want" to NATO

#87 Post by flockofseagulls104 » Tue Feb 20, 2024 11:10 pm

Weyoun wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2024 10:58 pm
flockofseagulls104 wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2024 9:52 pm
It is interesting how uncreative you are. WHATEVER Trump supports, you invariably support, too.
You know what, doc? You convinced me. I am just so uncreative. I am going to switch. I am not going to support everything Trump supports anymore. I'm gonna go with Sarah Sanders instead. How's that? Am I more creative now?
“Because we have a president who absolutely doesn’t care that millions and millions of people are coming across our border illegally. He has the power to shut the border down, to stop it. He can reinstate the remain in Mexico policy. He could actually build the wall. There is a lot of things he could be doing and this simply is a complete and total failure by this administration. In the state of Arkansas alone we seized enough fentanyl in the last year to kill every single person in our entire state,” Sanders began.

“That’s nearly 3 million people. Every man, woman and child. Enough fentanyl just in this state alone. It’s an absolute disgrace with this president is doing and it’s another great example while in November he has to go and Donald Trump has to be put back in place so we can secure our border and get our country back,” she added.

Watters jumped in and asked: “Do think Joe Biden loves this country?”

“If he did, he certainly wouldn’t be trying to destroy it second by second, minute by minute, hour by hour. That’s exactly what he’s doing. He’s allowed our economy to drop and our border to completely collapse. Our enemy certainly don’t fear us,” Sanders said.

She added: “Our allies don’t respect us. Literally every single thing he does is at the destruction and demise of the people in this country. I think it is frankly totally disgraceful and disqualifying for him to be president of the United States if he cannot do the simple job of securing our border either at the south or the north.
So remember that. doc. Don't accuse me of being a Trump supporter ever again. I'm with Sarah!
I don't think you understand that the border and Ukraine are two issues that are not mutually exclusive. I agree there needs to be better border control. Great. Next.
Of course I don't understand, doc. I don't understand anything, it's even in my signature. So you should have known that and not spent the effort in pointing it out. I don't have the capacity to understand a fraction of what you do, because you went to medical school and know everything about everything, just like trollboy. You get the same benefit at Acme Lawyer School where trollboy went.

So just keep putting me in my place. Maybe someday I will learn not to question you or doubt you. And it comforts me to know you think there needs to be better border control. I will sleep better tonite.
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Re: "Whatever the hell they want" to NATO

#88 Post by Bob78164 » Tue Feb 20, 2024 11:29 pm

Weyoun wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2024 6:29 pm
And Ukraine does need the resources, including money. Failure to do so will guarantee that above. That will give a victory to Russia, and its friends China and Iran. This isn't a domino theory theoretical - that war is happening RIGHT now.
Don't forget that because we're providing a lot of the armaments Ukraine is using, that extra money ends up right back here, in the hands of the Americans who built those armaments. --Bob
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Re: "Whatever the hell they want" to NATO

#89 Post by Bob78164 » Tue Feb 20, 2024 11:31 pm

Beebs52 wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2024 8:45 pm
Serious question. Why is there such a stagnation in that war now? Not trying to be ugly.
Ukraine is starting to run low on armaments, and can no longer replenish them in the necessary quantities, in significant part because Congress hasn't approved more aid. Europe is trying to fill the gap, but they really need more American money to maintain their ability not just to resist, but to prevail. --Bob
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Re: "Whatever the hell they want" to NATO

#90 Post by earendel » Wed Feb 21, 2024 7:22 am

Bob78164 wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2024 11:31 pm
Beebs52 wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2024 8:45 pm
Serious question. Why is there such a stagnation in that war now? Not trying to be ugly.
Ukraine is starting to run low on armaments, and can no longer replenish them in the necessary quantities, in significant part because Congress hasn't approved more aid. Europe is trying to fill the gap, but they really need more American money to maintain their ability not just to resist, but to prevail. --Bob
One solution I've read about is to use the $323 billion in frozen Russian assets in American and European banks. The US is pushing this among the G7 nations but the EU considers it to be legally questionable.
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Re: "Whatever the hell they want" to NATO

#91 Post by silverscreenselect » Wed Feb 21, 2024 7:46 am

earendel wrote:
Wed Feb 21, 2024 7:22 am
Bob78164 wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2024 11:31 pm
Beebs52 wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2024 8:45 pm
Serious question. Why is there such a stagnation in that war now? Not trying to be ugly.
Ukraine is starting to run low on armaments, and can no longer replenish them in the necessary quantities, in significant part because Congress hasn't approved more aid. Europe is trying to fill the gap, but they really need more American money to maintain their ability not just to resist, but to prevail. --Bob
One solution I've read about is to use the $323 billion in frozen Russian assets in American and European banks. The US is pushing this among the G7 nations but the EU considers it to be legally questionable.
I know where we can get $450 million soon. I'm sure the State of New York won't mind.
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Re: "Whatever the hell they want" to NATO

#92 Post by tlynn78 » Fri Feb 23, 2024 9:26 pm

silverscreenselect wrote:
Wed Feb 21, 2024 7:46 am
earendel wrote:
Wed Feb 21, 2024 7:22 am
Bob78164 wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2024 11:31 pm
Ukraine is starting to run low on armaments, and can no longer replenish them in the necessary quantities, in significant part because Congress hasn't approved more aid. Europe is trying to fill the gap, but they really need more American money to maintain their ability not just to resist, but to prevail. --Bob
One solution I've read about is to use the $323 billion in frozen Russian assets in American and European banks. The US is pushing this among the G7 nations but the EU considers it to be legally questionable.
I know where we can get $450 million soon. I'm sure the State of New York won't mind.
The State of NY will need those funds to support their illegals population.
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Re: "Whatever the hell they want" to NATO

#93 Post by flockofseagulls104 » Fri Feb 23, 2024 10:13 pm

tlynn78 wrote:
Fri Feb 23, 2024 9:26 pm
silverscreenselect wrote:
Wed Feb 21, 2024 7:46 am
earendel wrote:
Wed Feb 21, 2024 7:22 am

One solution I've read about is to use the $323 billion in frozen Russian assets in American and European banks. The US is pushing this among the G7 nations but the EU considers it to be legally questionable.
I know where we can get $450 million soon. I'm sure the State of New York won't mind.
The State of NY will need those funds to support their illegals population.
No problem. Just make up a crime that's never been prosecuted before. Extend the statute of limitations so you can go after your target and then have the judge decide guilt on his own and add punitive damages up the wazoo because, well just because he can. And he don't like what the victim says. You can raise trillions that way. Of course, you'll run out of other people's money sooner or later, but let's let someone else worry about that.
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Re: "Whatever the hell they want" to NATO

#94 Post by silverscreenselect » Fri Feb 23, 2024 10:57 pm

flockofseagulls104 wrote:
Fri Feb 23, 2024 10:13 pm
have the judge decide guilt on his own and add punitive damages up the wazoo because, well just because he can.
That's what judges do in every civil case in this country; they decide the liability (this is not a criminal case) of the defendant on their own if there is no jury trial. Trump did not object to the judge trying the case originally. And there are no punitive damages here. The judge added interest as allowed in every civil action in the state of New York. The judge went over the testimony of every witness in this case and made detailed findings why he did or did not find them credible. Half of his opinion is his commentary on witness testimony.

You just don't like the legal system when it comes to a different conclusion than you about Trump's honesty and business dealings. And I'd be willing to wager that the judge considered a whole lot more testimony and exhibits than you have.
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Re: "Whatever the hell they want" to NATO

#95 Post by flockofseagulls104 » Sun Mar 03, 2024 10:56 am

Here's some right-wing news.

Maybe as valid as the fake MSM news. Maybe not. Who knows?
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