question

[mrkelley23]

For those of you who think everything is hunky dory and going great so far: do you agree with Elon Musk bringing a team into our government, locking workers out of their computers, stealing petabytes of American citizens data, and firing government employees without any authorization?

Taking notes for future administrations.

[Beebs52]

There are so many obnoxious things that have happened during the last admin, that your, ya gotta admit, self satisfied attitude contributed to. And I appreciate your take....sometimes.

[mrkelley23]

There are so many obnoxious things that have happened during the last admin, that your, ya gotta admit, self satisfied attitude contributed to. And I appreciate your take....sometimes.

List them, please? I may agree with you. One of the biggest communication problems we have is that one side assumes that everyone on the other side agrees with everything the people in power do.

Not sure what has established my attitude as self-satisfied, but I'm willing to dialogue about it.

[flockofseagulls104]

For those of you who think everything is hunky dory and going great so far: do you agree with Elon Musk bringing a team into our government, locking workers out of their computers, stealing petabytes of American citizens data, and firing government employees without any authorization?

Taking notes for future administrations.

Elon Musk is as much of a government worker as any of the perpetual bureaucrats that are being fired. He was appointed to the position on weeding out government waste and corruption. Seems there is a lot of it. And who says he is stealing anything? Any proof? Or just allegations by anonymous sources?

Elon was a hero of the left until he decided he was supporting Trump. Now he is public enemy number one. So predictable.

[mrkelley23]

For those of you who think everything is hunky dory and going great so far: do you agree with Elon Musk bringing a team into our government, locking workers out of their computers, stealing petabytes of American citizens data, and firing government employees without any authorization?

Taking notes for future administrations.

Elon Musk is as much of a government worker as any of the perpetual bureaucrats that are being fired. He was appointed to the position on weeding out government waste and corruption. Seems there is a lot of it. And who says he is stealing anything? Any proof? Or just allegations by anonymous sources?

Elon was a hero of the left until he decided he was supporting Trump. Now he is public enemy number one. So predictable.

He was not appointed to any position. He is not a government worker in any sense of the word. His team brought hard drives to OPM and left with them, with no oversight. I'm sure you think that was all clean and above-board, just like when he harvested Twitter users' data under the guise of registering them to vote.

[flockofseagulls104]

There are so many obnoxious things that have happened during the last admin, that your, ya gotta admit, self satisfied attitude contributed to. And I appreciate your take....sometimes.

List them, please? I may agree with you. One of the biggest communication problems we have is that one side assumes that everyone on the other side agrees with everything the people in power do.

Not sure what has established my attitude as self-satisfied, but I'm willing to dialogue about it.

Oh, Here is where you are asking for a list.

This is off the top of my head. Forgive me for not being complete.

- Completely disasterous, stupid, disorganized, embarassing and deadly withdrawl from Afghanistan.
- Using the Justice Department to try and take out your political opponents.
- Anthony Blinken organizing 51 members of the intelligence deep state to interfere with the 2020 election.
- Hiding the senility of the 46th President for 4 years until it could be hidden no longer.
- Canonizing the VP through smoke-filled backrooms to run for President without any input or guidance from your party membership when biden's senility could no longer be hidden
- Declaring one protest run amok an 'insurrection', creating a Soviet Style star chamber hearing, broadcast in Prime Time to further that false claim, while ignoring other protests that resulted in many deaths, property destruction and vandalism because it furthered your political aims and covered up your incompetence.
- Ignoring all immigration policies and laws to let in MILLIONS of illegal aliens, again for perceived political gain.
- Coordinating with the lapdog legacy and social media to cancel, censor and denigrate opposing views on pretty much any subject.

I could go on, but I have other things to do. Are you going to give us the talking point excuses for all these things, or just claim ignorance or say 'all these have been debunked', without telling us exactly who debunked them?

[mrkelley23]

There are so many obnoxious things that have happened during the last admin, that your, ya gotta admit, self satisfied attitude contributed to. And I appreciate your take....sometimes.

List them, please? I may agree with you. One of the biggest communication problems we have is that one side assumes that everyone on the other side agrees with everything the people in power do.

Not sure what has established my attitude as self-satisfied, but I'm willing to dialogue about it.

Oh, Here is where you are asking for a list.

This is off the top of my head. Forgive me for not being complete.

- Completely disasterous, stupid, disorganized, embarassing and deadly withdrawl from Afghanistan.
- Using the Justice Department to try and take out your political opponents.
- Anthony Blinken organizing 51 members of the intelligence deep state to interfere with the 2020 election.
- Hiding the senility of the 46th President for 4 years until it could be hidden no longer.
- Canonizing the VP through smoke-filled backrooms to run for President without any input or guidance from your party membership when biden's senility could no longer be hidden
- Declaring one protest run amok an 'insurrection', creating a Soviet Style star chamber hearing, broadcast in Prime Time to further that false claim, while ignoring other protests that resulted in many deaths, property destruction and vandalism because it furthered your political aims and covered up your incompetence.
- Ignoring all immigration policies and laws to let in MILLIONS of illegal aliens, again for perceived political gain.
- Coordinating with the lapdog legacy and social media to cancel, censor and denigrate opposing views.

I could go on, but I have other things to do. Are you going to give us the talking point excuses for all these things, or just claim ignorance or say 'all these have been debunked', without telling us exactly who debunked them?
-

Amazing how similar your and tlynn's lists are. It's almost like you're getting your news from the same sources. I'm not going to respond to the same ones over again, but you can consult her list for my responses to those, if you wish. As far as the other ones:

"Hiding the senility of the 46th President for 4 years until it could be hidden no longer. " Are you saying that Joe Biden was senile when he beat Donald Trump in 2020? Yes, he beat him. There is no doubt, all the caterwauling to the contrary. If you have actual evidence of enough states' voting results being affected to actually change the results of the election, I and several million Americans would be fascinated to hear them. So far, all I've seen from you is that you want to change the results of about 6000 votes in Georgia which, even if you were successful in changing ALL of them, would not even flip Georgia, let alone the whole election. So what I'm hearing you say is that Donald Trump was beaten by a senile old man in 2020. Now, as to the actual question: is Biden senile? I don't know, and neither do you. Chances are, we won't find out as long as he is alive. As I'm sure you know, Alzheimer's can't be diagnosed until after death. I do know that Ronald Reagan was senile for the last year-and-a half of his presidency. Does that matter? Now, do I wish Joe Biden had followed through on his promise to be a transitional president, and announced in January that he wouldn't run again, so we could have had an actual primary? Absolutely yes. I think whoever emerged would have beaten Trump soundly. Instead, we had a weak candidate who didn't have the experience of being beat up on in a primary. Do I regret that? Yes. Do I think it was illegal, unConstitutional, or reprehensible? Emphatically No. Just incompetent, as so many Democratic actions of the last 50 years have been.

" Declaring one protest run amok an 'insurrection', creating a Soviet Style star chamber hearing, broadcast in Prime Time to further that false claim, while ignoring other protests that resulted in many deaths, property destruction and vandalism because it furthered your political aims and covered up your incompetence." -- So many trigger words and emotional outlay in this one. I think you had better look up the terms "Soviet," "Star chamber", and "insurrection," because it is clear from your comment that you don't really understand the definitions. I am glad, however, that you characterize it as a protest run amok. That is how I would characterize it, too. The difference between us is that I would say that Stewart Rhodes and others, knowing full well what they were doing, incited the other folks to perform an insurrection by the dictionary definition of that term. I do think a lot of otherwise innocent people were punished for January 6, caught up in a moment of enthusiasm for their favored candidate. And at least one, Ashli Babbitt, paid the ultimate price for her actions. But it was, by definition, an insurrection against the US government.

"Ignoring all immigration policies and laws to let in MILLIONS of illegal aliens, again for perceived political gain." I beg you to actually look at the numbers. So far, at least, they are available to the public, although I don't expect them to be for long. I have already posted about how I believe that TPS (Temporary Protected Status) is not good policy, and should be revoked and replaced with something passed by the Congress. But even TPS would not achieve political gain, because NONE of those people would be allowed to vote in any state of the Union. Also, the number of "illegal aliens" (your term) in the US at the end of Biden's term, was less than the all time high in 2007 (under a Republican administration). We all agree (see my post of a few weeks ago) that immigration policy should be adjusted. So what can WE do about it?

"Coordinating with the lapdog legacy and social media to cancel, censor and denigrate opposing views." Boy, no prejudicial language in that clause, is there? Let's start with Twitter, since that came up earlier. Yes, I still call it Twitter, because our government says that no one is allowed to transition to another name. There are several clear and evidential instances of Twitter canceling, censoring, and denigrating opposing views.

I have given you, I believe, serious answers to your points, even if you don't agree with all of them, without resorting to name-calling or ad hominem. I hope that you will continue to do the same.

[Weyoun]

Does anyone remember Donald Trump running on the idea of having the world’s richest person being given access to my personal data?

I don’t remember that one.

The tiresome whataboutism of the crowd here is irrelevant. Every time Donald Trump does something bad, I don’t have to answer for Joe Biden. He’s no longer president. Joe Biden did not send a 19 year-old into every government office to illegally shut down lawfully approved agencies, or stop the distribution of funds they have already been given.

What Donald Trump effectively is doing a line item veto, which already has been ruled unconstitutional.

And then to hear that these unelected proxies have my personal data - absolutely frightening. People like flock love the idea, because they think that now they have the information to inflict revenge on Americans that they view as the enemy. I suppose that would include me, because I think they’re all full of shit.

To think the same crowd gets their panties in the wad if parents at a school board get hassled for complaining about students having to read books written by Black people.

It’s all part of the package. Flock over and over again has been about revenge, mostly over perceived offenses that never happened (he’s never offered a single piece of physical evidence that the 2020 election was actually stolen - that is, there were many fake votes, and there’s many fake votes pushes the election Biden).

He is willing to trash our historical understanding of the executive office to do that, despite crying about Biden‘s overreach previously.

He is willing to let actual teenagers go through my personal files. And now Elon Musk knows my Social Security number.

What next?

[flockofseagulls104]

I won't go into your response other than to say you give no hard evidence to support your opinions other than to say I am wrong and you are right.

On this statement:

I and several million Americans would be fascinated to hear them. So far, all I've seen from you is that you want to change the results of about 6000 votes in Georgia which, even if you were successful in changing ALL of them, would not even flip Georgia, let alone the whole election.

MRK, you may question my veracity on this issue, but I have presented 100% more PROOF than you have, or the politicians or media have to support my position.

I explained, step by step, on this bored, how I individually and personally verified, in the 1500 pardons thread, one specific instance of the politically biased government lying to us and indicting their political opponents based on that lie. JUST ONE INDIVIDUAL EXAMPLE. I could do it. Why doesn't the media, who's job it is to do these things, do it?

I suggest, if you are really sincere, that you lookup THE GANERDS on rumble or twitter, assuming you are willing to take the chance that your computer will be hijacked by doing so. This group has documented a great deal of outright fraud committed by the Georgia Powers That Be. I am not an official member of that group, but I know Kim Brooks and she has asked my help to verify some things she found in my county. GANERDS has a lot more data than I have, so I can't verify all of her findings. But I have personally verified several of her findings with data I have and every one of those have proved 100% true.

Yeah. You can claim I have only given you evidence of one example of fraud that wouldn't have changed the election. There are hundreds, maybe even thousands, of other proven examples of fraud. If a bad actor with unlimited resources and people on the inside wanted to change the results of an election, how stupid would they be to put all their eggs in one basket, MRK? And private citizens have found hundreds of examples. Without any support from the media or our own supposed elected representatives. Oh. did I say 'support'. Forgive me. I meant they actively oppose and stymie us at every opportunity.

In addition, I don't know if I shared this on the bored, I have personal experience on how the legacy media works. Forgive me if I repeat myself.

I live in DeKalb County, GA. It is not as infamous as SSS's county, Fulton, but it is operated by the same machine as Fulton and is bobby's dream: controlled by one party. Guess which one.

At a DeKalb Co Election Board meeting last year, in which a friend of mine was challenging registrations that had Post Offices and Business addresses as their Residence address, CBS 'journalist' Major Garrett showed up. The proud author of a book on 'The Big Lie'. They were notified by 'someone' to do a story about citizen challenges. They interviewed my friend, the challenger. The questions they asked were all about whether she was an 'election denier' and if she thought Trump won the 2020 election. Nothing about the reason why she was challenging the registrations.

I had talked to Major's producer, a guy named Michael Kaplan, and I got his card. After the 'interview', I emailed him and expressed concern about the questions Garrett had asked my friend, and offered him the opportunity to understand why we were concerned about these registrations and show him why we, and he, should be concerned. He agreed to have a zoom call with me the next week. Our group worked on a 15 minute presentation to show him the problems with the voter roll and were ready to present it to him. 2 hours before the scheduled zoom call, he emailed me that they had their story and didn't need to hear from us. I have all the receipts. What would that say to you, MRK?

They went with their story, without any input from us, and painted my friend Gail on national TV as an 'election denier' who wanted to disenfranchize people of color. Ifonly would be so proud of Major Garrett, Michael Kaplan and CBS News.

So, I'm sorry, MRK. Your arguments do not hold any water for me. Present me documented and repeatable proof for your pronouncements.

[Weyoun]

I won't go into your response other than to say you give no hard evidence to support your opinions other than to say I am wrong and you are right.

On this statement:

I and several million Americans would be fascinated to hear them. So far, all I've seen from you is that you want to change the results of about 6000 votes in Georgia which, even if you were successful in changing ALL of them, would not even flip Georgia, let alone the whole election.

MRK, you may question my veracity on this issue, but I have presented 100% more PROOF than you have, or the politicians or media have to support my position.

I explained, step by step, on this bored, how I individually and personally verified, in the 1500 pardons thread, one specific instance of the politically biased government lying to us and indicting their political opponents based on that lie. JUST ONE INDIVIDUAL EXAMPLE. I could do it. Why doesn't the media, who's job it is to do these things, do it?

I suggest, if you are really sincere, that you lookup THE GANERDS on rumble or twitter, assuming you are willing to take the chance that your computer will be hijacked by doing so. This group has documented a great deal of outright fraud committed by the Georgia Powers That Be. I am not an official member of that group, but I know Kim Brooks and she has asked my help to verify some things she found in my county. GANERDS has a lot more data than I have, so I can't verify all of her findings. But I have personally verified several of her findings with data I have and every one of those have proved 100% true.

Yeah. You can claim I have only given you evidence of one example of fraud that wouldn't have changed the election. There are hundreds, maybe even thousands, of other proven examples of fraud. If a bad actor with unlimited resources and people on the inside wanted to change the results of an election, how stupid would they be to put all their eggs in one basket, MRK? And private citizens have found hundreds of examples. Without any support from the media or our own supposed elected representatives. Oh. did I say 'support'. Forgive me. I meant they actively oppose and stymie us at every opportunity.

In addition, I don't know if I shared this on the bored, I have personal experience on how the legacy media works. Forgive me if I repeat myself.

I live in DeKalb County, GA. It is not as infamous as SSS's county, Fulton, but it is operated by the same machine as Fulton and is bobby's dream: controlled by one party. Guess which one.

At a DeKalb Co Election Board meeting last year, in which a friend of mine was challenging registrations that had Post Offices and Business addresses as their Residence address, CBS 'journalist' Major Garrett showed up. The proud author of a book on 'The Big Lie'. They were notified by 'someone' to do a story about citizen challenges. They interviewed my friend, the challenger. The questions they asked were all about whether she was an 'election denier' and if she thought Trump won the 2020 election. Nothing about the reason why she was challenging the registrations.

I had talked to Major's producer, a guy named Michael Kaplan, and I got his card. After the 'interview', I emailed him and expressed concern about the questions Garrett had asked my friend, and offered him the opportunity to understand why we were concerned about these registrations and show him why we, and he, should be concerned. He agreed to have a zoom call with me the next week. Our group worked on a 15 minute presentation to show him the problems with the voter roll and were ready to present it to him. 2 hours before the scheduled zoom call, he emailed me that they had their story and didn't need to hear from us. I have all the receipts. What would that say to you, MRK?

They went with their story, without any input from us, and painted my friend Gail on national TV as an 'election denier' who wanted to disenfranchize people of color. Ifonly would be so proud of Major Garrett, Michael Kaplan and CBS News.

So, I'm sorry, MRK. Your arguments do not hold any water for me. Present me documented and repeatable proof for your pronouncements.

Blah blah blah. Again, do you have a single example of a person representing the Democrats casting or arranging the casting of multiple illegal ballots?

You keep droning on about how someone said something in court at some point that wasn’t true, asking us to extrapolate that everything must be a lie then, so everything you say must be true. That’s not how it works.

Elections are discrete things. There are a certain number of votes cast. What votes cast were illegal? How many? Who cast them?

The reason your position has never had traction is that you’ve never been able to show anything suggesting that. You’ve had five years. And you don’t even see Trump investigating it because everyone in power knows it is a Big Lie.

[flockofseagulls104]

I won't go into your response other than to say you give no hard evidence to support your opinions other than to say I am wrong and you are right.

On this statement:

I and several million Americans would be fascinated to hear them. So far, all I've seen from you is that you want to change the results of about 6000 votes in Georgia which, even if you were successful in changing ALL of them, would not even flip Georgia, let alone the whole election.

MRK, you may question my veracity on this issue, but I have presented 100% more PROOF than you have, or the politicians or media have to support my position.

I explained, step by step, on this bored, how I individually and personally verified, in the 1500 pardons thread, one specific instance of the politically biased government lying to us and indicting their political opponents based on that lie. JUST ONE INDIVIDUAL EXAMPLE. I could do it. Why doesn't the media, who's job it is to do these things, do it?

I suggest, if you are really sincere, that you lookup THE GANERDS on rumble or twitter, assuming you are willing to take the chance that your computer will be hijacked by doing so. This group has documented a great deal of outright fraud committed by the Georgia Powers That Be. I am not an official member of that group, but I know Kim Brooks and she has asked my help to verify some things she found in my county. GANERDS has a lot more data than I have, so I can't verify all of her findings. But I have personally verified several of her findings with data I have and every one of those have proved 100% true.

Yeah. You can claim I have only given you evidence of one example of fraud that wouldn't have changed the election. There are hundreds, maybe even thousands, of other proven examples of fraud. If a bad actor with unlimited resources and people on the inside wanted to change the results of an election, how stupid would they be to put all their eggs in one basket, MRK? And private citizens have found hundreds of examples. Without any support from the media or our own supposed elected representatives. Oh. did I say 'support'. Forgive me. I meant they actively oppose and stymie us at every opportunity.

In addition, I don't know if I shared this on the bored, I have personal experience on how the legacy media works. Forgive me if I repeat myself.

I live in DeKalb County, GA. It is not as infamous as SSS's county, Fulton, but it is operated by the same machine as Fulton and is bobby's dream: controlled by one party. Guess which one.

At a DeKalb Co Election Board meeting last year, in which a friend of mine was challenging registrations that had Post Offices and Business addresses as their Residence address, CBS 'journalist' Major Garrett showed up. The proud author of a book on 'The Big Lie'. They were notified by 'someone' to do a story about citizen challenges. They interviewed my friend, the challenger. The questions they asked were all about whether she was an 'election denier' and if she thought Trump won the 2020 election. Nothing about the reason why she was challenging the registrations.

I had talked to Major's producer, a guy named Michael Kaplan, and I got his card. After the 'interview', I emailed him and expressed concern about the questions Garrett had asked my friend, and offered him the opportunity to understand why we were concerned about these registrations and show him why we, and he, should be concerned. He agreed to have a zoom call with me the next week. Our group worked on a 15 minute presentation to show him the problems with the voter roll and were ready to present it to him. 2 hours before the scheduled zoom call, he emailed me that they had their story and didn't need to hear from us. I have all the receipts. What would that say to you, MRK?

They went with their story, without any input from us, and painted my friend Gail on national TV as an 'election denier' who wanted to disenfranchize people of color. Ifonly would be so proud of Major Garrett, Michael Kaplan and CBS News.

So, I'm sorry, MRK. Your arguments do not hold any water for me. Present me documented and repeatable proof for your pronouncements.

Blah blah blah. Again, do you have a single example of a person representing the Democrats casting or arranging the casting of multiple illegal ballots?

You keep droning on about how someone said something in court at some point that wasn’t true, asking us to extrapolate that everything must be a lie then, so everything you say must be true. That’s not how it works.

Elections are discrete things. There are a certain number of votes cast. What votes cast were illegal? How many? Who cast them?

The reason your position has never had traction is that you’ve never been able to show anything suggesting that. You’ve had five years. And you don’t even see Trump investigating it because everyone in power knows it is a Big Lie.

Thank you for illustrating my point so colorfully. It is very difficult to communicate rationally with the willfully and religiously ignorant.

[BackInTex]

For those of you who think everything is hunky dory and going great so far: do you agree with Elon Musk bringing a team into our government, locking workers out of their computers, stealing petabytes of American citizens data, and firing government employees without any authorization?

Taking notes for future administrations.

A few questions of your question:
How are you determining that the data was "stolen". That is a legal term.
How do you know there wasn't any authorization?

[mrkelley23]

I won't go into your response other than to say you give no hard evidence to support your opinions other than to say I am wrong and you are right.

On this statement:

I and several million Americans would be fascinated to hear them. So far, all I've seen from you is that you want to change the results of about 6000 votes in Georgia which, even if you were successful in changing ALL of them, would not even flip Georgia, let alone the whole election.

MRK, you may question my veracity on this issue, but I have presented 100% more PROOF than you have, or the politicians or media have to support my position.

[text deleted for brevity]

So, I'm sorry, MRK. Your arguments do not hold any water for me. Present me documented and repeatable proof for your pronouncements.

And that's okay. I didn't expect to change any minds. As far as proof, I'm not sure what you would accept. My responses were an attempt to provide a reasonable argument, a series of logical deductions and inductions, which is different from merely citing sources. If you have questions about any of my inferences, and would like to know where they came from, I'll be happy to share. For instance, in my answer to the "insurrection" post, I suggested you look up the legal definition of insurrection. Here is the actual wording of the federal law. Because the leaders of the action, by its very title, were there to "Stop the Steal," and because many of them chose violence that day, the day that Congress was certifying the outcome of the election, they were participating in an insurrection.

And for what it's worth, I have not questioned your veracity on the voting issue. I do think you have a lot of confirmation bias going on in your findings, but that's a value judgment, and so could be wrong. But it doesn't reflect poorly on your truthfulness, nor even your intent.