Olympic teams sports finals and semifinals

[andrewjackson]

The team sports in the Olympics are getting down to the nitty-gritty. All 8 of what I consider solely team sports are down to at least the semifinal rounds. I guess Baseball and Softball are classified as different sports but I tend to pair them up. Spoilerized for your protection since a basketball and volleyball game just ended:

Spoiler

Baseball/Softball
Softball Final
USA v. Japan

Baseball semi-finals
USA v. Cuba
South Korea v. Japan

Basketball
Men's semifinals
Spain v. Lithuania
USA v. Argentina

Women's semifinals
Russia v. USA
China v. Australia

Beach Volleyball
Women's final
China v. USA

Men's final
USA v. Brazil

Volleyball
Men's semifinals
Brazil v. Italy
Russia v. USA

Women's semifinals
Cuba v. USA
China v. Brazil

Water Polo
Women's final
USA v. Netherlands

Men's semifinals
Serbia v. USA
Montenegro v. Hungary

Field Hockey
Women's final
Netherlands v. China

Men's semifinals
Spain v. Australia
Netherlands v. Germany

Team Handball
Men's semifinals
France v. Croatia
Iceland v. Spain

Women's semifinals
Hungary v. Russia
Norway v. South Korea

Soccer
Men's final
Nigeria v. Argentina

Women's final
Brazil v. USA

[earendel]

The team sports in the Olympics are getting down to the nitty-gritty. All 8 of what I consider solely team sports are down to at least the semifinal rounds. I guess Baseball and Softball are classified as different sports but I tend to pair them up. Spoilerized for your protection since a basketball and volleyball game just ended:

Spoiler

Baseball/Softball
Softball Final
USA v. Japan

Baseball semi-finals
USA v. Cuba
South Korea v. Japan

Basketball
Men's semifinals
Spain v. Lithuania
USA v. Argentina

Women's semifinals
Russia v. USA
China v. Australia

Beach Volleyball
Women's final
China v. USA

Men's final
USA v. Brazil

Volleyball
Men's semifinals
Brazil v. Italy
Russia v. USA

Women's semifinals
Cuba v. USA
China v. Brazil

Water Polo
Women's final
USA v. Netherlands

Men's semifinals
Serbia v. USA
Montenegro v. Hungary

Field Hockey
Women's final
Netherlands v. China

Men's semifinals
Spain v. Australia
Netherlands v. Germany

Team Handball
Men's semifinals
France v. Croatia
Iceland v. Spain

Women's semifinals
Hungary v. Russia
Norway v. South Korea

Soccer
Men's final
Nigeria v. Argentina

Women's final
Brazil v. USA

With respect to water polo:

Spoiler

I read an article that suggested Serbia deliberately tanked one of their games so that they would end up going against the US in the semi-finals, since our team is considered the weakest of the four. I can't believe that a team would actually do this, given the possibility that they might lose another game and possibly miss the semi-finals entirely.

[NellyLunatic1980]

Oh joy. MM Melo and the rest of the Redeem Dream Team get to play the defending gold medalists, Argentina.

[earendel]

With China now 19 gold medals ahead of the US (although we lead the total medal count by three), are there enough events remaining in which the US is likely to win gold for us to catch China in the standings?

[BackInTex]

With China now 19 gold medals ahead of the US (although we lead the total medal count by three), are there enough events remaining in which the US is likely to win gold for us to catch China in the standings?

I don't know the answer to this, but on a per capita basis we are kicking their butts!

Of course using that logic Austrailia is pretty much kicking everyones butts! 1 gold for every 1.9 million people.

[andrewjackson]

I really dislike those medals per capita comparisons. Entries into the Olympics are limited by country so comparing the final results on a per capita basis is completely inaccurate.

Swimming is a great example. Each country is only allowed two entries per individual event and one entry in each relay. In some events the competition at the U.S or Australian qualification meets is tougher than at the Olympics.

In track and field, countries are allowed to send up to three qualifying athletes in each event. Fair enough, that means one country is capable of winning all three medals but a large country would also benefit from this changing to entries based on population. If the U.S. could send six athletes in each event there is a better chance that any of the individuals would win medals.

There are rules like that in many sports. Only if the number of entries were on a per capita basis would it make sense to compare per capita results.

[andrewjackson]

With China now 19 gold medals ahead of the US (although we lead the total medal count by three), are there enough events remaining in which the US is likely to win gold for us to catch China in the standings?

I don't think there is any chance for the U.S. to catch China in gold medals. To have the most overall medals, yes, but not golds. There are 302 total gold medals in these Games and 216 have already been awarded. That leaves 86 still to go. The U.S. would have to win almost everything we are still alive in to get to 45 and that would assume that China wouldn't win anything else.

In 2004 the U.S. had 36 gold medals to China's 32. That's a pretty incredible increase even if China doesn't win any more.

[BackInTex]

I really dislike those medals per capita comparisons. Entries into the Olympics are limited by country so comparing the final results on a per capita basis is completely inaccurate.

Swimming is a great example. Each country is only allowed two entries per individual event and one entry in each relay. In some events the competition at the U.S or Australian qualification meets is tougher than at the Olympics.

In track and field, countries are allowed to send up to three qualifying athletes in each event. Fair enough, that means one country is capable of winning all three medals but a large country would also benefit from this changing to entries based on population. If the U.S. could send six athletes in each event there is a better chance that any of the individuals would win medals.

There are rules like that in many sports. Only if the number of entries were on a per capita basis would it make sense to compare per capita results.

No, you are looking at it the wrong way (to get my point).

We have two entries and have a pool of 300 million to choose from.
China gets two entries and has a pool of 1.3 billion to choose from.
Australia gets two entries and has a pool of only 20 million to choose from.


Or to put it in your terms,
China has 1.3 billion entries. They do their own qualifications.
We have 300 million entries and do our own qualifiying.
Etc.

I'm not talking about probabilities of winning. I'm talking about probabilities of having the best athletes. With the best athletes come the winnings.

If someone told you you could choose 1 racehorse to own. Just pick 1 farm, A or B, and then go examine all the horses that farm has and take your pick. You know nothing about the farms other than farm A has 1,000 horses and farm be has 12 horses, which farm would you go to?

[BackInTex]

Of course the real reason China is suceeding in the medal count is that they are evaluating all 1.3 billion horses then picking the ones with the talents and apptitudes, pulling them away from their families and raising them in state funded boarding schools with one objective in mind for that child. Too bad if the child doesn't want to be a diver, the child will be a diver, and he'll LIKE IT!

[Here's Fanny!]

Of course the real reason China is suceeding in the medal count is that they are evaluating all 1.3 billion horses then picking the ones with the talents and apptitudes, pulling them away from their families and raising them in state funded boarding schools with one objective in mind for that child. Too bad if the child doesn't want to be a diver, the child will be a diver, and he'll LIKE IT!

No he won't. But that doesn't really matter.

China is the new USSR. One thing I have been surprised at is the number of left handed Chinese athletes (in sports where you can tell). They used to be having none of that nonsense. I guess they decided success in athletics was worth letting them use whatever hand they wanted. Ha!



PS Lietuva YAY!!!11

Spoiler

I don't know how to say YAY!!!11 in Lithuanian.

[PlacentiaSoccerMom]

With China now 19 gold medals ahead of the US (although we lead the total medal count by three), are there enough events remaining in which the US is likely to win gold for us to catch China in the standings?

I am sure that China has many more 14 year olds in reserve to keep their gold medal count up.

[PlacentiaSoccerMom]

Of course the real reason China is suceeding in the medal count is that they are evaluating all 1.3 billion horses then picking the ones with the talents and apptitudes, pulling them away from their families and raising them in state funded boarding schools with one objective in mind for that child. Too bad if the child doesn't want to be a diver, the child will be a diver, and he'll LIKE IT!

The parents go along with it because they get houses in exchange for their kids doing well.

[SportsFan68]

With the best athletes come the winnings.

This is horrible -- I now think you can add pharmaceuticals to the list of what makes a winner.

You can exempt the women gymnasts (I hope -- those slight builds and beautiful clear eyes make me think there's been no pharmacological enhancement), although the Chinese sure didn't have any trouble finding another way to cheat.

But the track and fielders -- good grief! Every winner I saw was cut and buff. A local who used to coach collegiate swimmers told me that he got out of the business when he realized how many athletes were using, they just weren't getting caught. He said that if athletes are really careful with dosages, they can dodge a positive result. He said he's sure Phelps isn't using and is equally sure that Torres is because of their histories.

Maybe I'm putting too much weight on his assertions. I just think he's right. Where drug use helps them, I think most are using.

Where's that magic wand...

[PlacentiaSoccerMom]

My husband knows somebody who competed in the Olympics twice, once in Greece and once with Sydney.

He said that most people "juiced." (He also said that they ran out of food in Athens so he athletes had to go out and buy their own.)

[andrewjackson]

I really dislike those medals per capita comparisons. Entries into the Olympics are limited by country so comparing the final results on a per capita basis is completely inaccurate.

Swimming is a great example. Each country is only allowed two entries per individual event and one entry in each relay. In some events the competition at the U.S or Australian qualification meets is tougher than at the Olympics.

In track and field, countries are allowed to send up to three qualifying athletes in each event. Fair enough, that means one country is capable of winning all three medals but a large country would also benefit from this changing to entries based on population. If the U.S. could send six athletes in each event there is a better chance that any of the individuals would win medals.

There are rules like that in many sports. Only if the number of entries were on a per capita basis would it make sense to compare per capita results.

No, you are looking at it the wrong way (to get my point).

We have two entries and have a pool of 300 million to choose from.
China gets two entries and has a pool of 1.3 billion to choose from.
Australia gets two entries and has a pool of only 20 million to choose from.


Or to put it in your terms,
China has 1.3 billion entries. They do their own qualifications.
We have 300 million entries and do our own qualifiying.
Etc.

I'm not talking about probabilities of winning. I'm talking about probabilities of having the best athletes. With the best athletes come the winnings.

If someone told you you could choose 1 racehorse to own. Just pick 1 farm, A or B, and then go examine all the horses that farm has and take your pick. You know nothing about the farms other than farm A has 1,000 horses and farm be has 12 horses, which farm would you go to?

I still disagree. Let's look at your example. If the little farm wins a race, that's one gold medal per 12 horses. The big farm would have to win 83 races to have the same ratio. But you are only letting each farm have one representative. How can the big farm possibly compete on a per horse back on the farm basis?

Right now in the Olympics, Jamaica has won 5 gold medals. They have a population of 2.7 million. So that's one gold medal per 540,000 residents. The U.S. would have to win 555 gold medals to have the same ratio. But there are only 302 gold medals awarded in the entire Olympics.

[andrewjackson]

Updated after games of Thursday, August 21. There were the Softball, Women's Beach Volleyball, Women's Soccer, and Women's Water Polo finals today. Also semifinals in Women's Basketball, Women's Team Handball, Women's Volleyball, and Men's Field Hockey.

Spoiler

Baseball/Softball
Softball Final
Japan 3-1 USA

Baseball semi-finals
USA v. Cuba
South Korea v. Japan

Basketball
Men's semifinals
Spain v. Lithuania
USA v. Argentina

Women's semifinals
USA 67-52 Russia
Australia 90-56 China

Beach Volleyball
Women's final
USA 2-0 China

Men's final
USA v. Brazil

Volleyball
Men's semifinals
Brazil v. Italy
Russia v. USA

Women's semifinals
USA 3-0 Cuba
Brazil 3-0 China

Water Polo
Women's final
Netherlands 9-8 USA

Men's semifinals
Serbia v. USA
Montenegro v. Hungary

Field Hockey
Women's final
Netherlands v. China

Men's semifinals
Spain 3-2 Australia
Germany 1-1 Netherlands (Germany advances on penalty shots 4-3)

Team Handball
Men's semifinals
France v. Croatia
Iceland v. Spain

Women's semifinals
Russia 22-20 Hungary
Norway 29-28 South Korea

Soccer
Men's final
Nigeria v. Argentina

Women's final
USA 1-0 Brazil, aet

[Appa23]

As so many here are trivia-minded, according to cnnsi.com, it would appear that the USA's 1000th gold medal in official Olympic competition was won by:

Spoiler

the Women's soccer team, defending its title and reaffirming its position as the #1 ranked squad in the world.

I have not entirely verified as accurate.

[BackInTex]

This is horrible -- I now think you can add pharmaceuticals to the list of what makes a winner.

You can exempt the women gymnasts (I hope -- those slight builds and beautiful clear eyes make me think there's been no pharmacological enhancement), although the Chinese sure didn't have any trouble finding another way to cheat.

But the track and fielders -- good grief! Every winner I saw was cut and buff. A local who used to coach collegiate swimmers told me that he got out of the business when he realized how many athletes were using, they just weren't getting caught. He said that if athletes are really careful with dosages, they can dodge a positive result. He said he's sure Phelps isn't using and is equally sure that Torres is because of their histories.

Maybe I'm putting too much weight on his assertions. I just think he's right. Where drug use helps them, I think most are using.

Where's that magic wand...

Yes, you see the amazing performance of Bolt, who a couple years ago was just competative, and you go 'hmmmm.....'.

[BackInTex]

Right now in the Olympics, Jamaica has won 5 gold medals. They have a population of 2.7 million. So that's one gold medal per 540,000 residents. The U.S. would have to win 555 gold medals to have the same ratio. But there are only 302 gold medals awarded in the entire Olympics.

No, the U.S. would only have to win 3 more gold medals, in 3 events that Jamaica won. And China to win 2 more (the other two events).

Jamaica is clearly doing better than us or China in earning gold medals with what they have.

I understand what you are saying but for a country like the Soloman Islands, they would have to bring everyone to compete in all the events and you are still saying they would have an equal chance because they have as many entries.

The real statistical answer, if that is the right phrase, is somewhere between my methodology and yours.

[silvercamaro]

Jamaica is clearly doing better than us or China in earning gold medals with what they have.

What they have is a superb gene pool for creating babies with a high percentage of fast-twitch muscle.

[earendel]

The gold medal softball game, featuring the US and Japan, is over.

Spoiler

In a shocker Japan defeated the US 3-1 to thwart the US bid for a fourth gold medal in this sport, which is being dropped from the Olympics after this year.

[macrae1234]

Re 1000th gold medal
US has 29 medals and had 972 going into these game so the 28th gold medal was won by

Spoiler

Lashawn Merrill who won the 400 metres at 21:20 and finished 43.75 seconds later, since the soccer game started at 21:00 and AJ and I posted at 20:30 (all times Beijing) they were 1001th, Misty and Kerri were 999th

[silverscreenselect]

For years, the East German team played the same game as the Chinese are doing now, with a much smaller population. Their goal each time was to win as many total medals as possible, so they emphasized individual sports like track, swimming and gymnastics as opposed to team sports like basketball or soccer(where it takes 10 to 20 athletes to win one single medal).

[macrae1234]

Like their illegally enhanced women’s swim team.
1976 Women’s swimming results
100 m backstroke
Ulrike Richter East Germany (GDR) 1:01.83
Birgit Treiber East Germany (GDR) 1:03.41
Nancy Garapick Canada (CAN) 1:03.71
200 m backstroke
Ulrike Richter East Germany (GDR) 2:13.43
Birgit Treiber East Germany (GDR) 2:14.97
Nancy Garapick Canada (CAN) 2:15.60
200 m butterfly
Andrea Pollack East Germany (GDR) 2:11.41
Ulrike Tauber East Germany (GDR) 2:12.50
Rosemarie Gabriel East Germany (GDR) 2:12.86
Cheryl Gibson was 4th
400 m individual medley
Ulrike Tauber East Germany (GDR) 4:42.77
Cheryl Gibson Canada (CAN) 4:48.10
Becky Smith Canada (CAN) 4:50.

Shirley Babashoff also lost 4 gold medals losing the 200, 400 and 800 metre freestyle to Kornelia Ender and Petra Thumer.

Mac who is still bitter that Canada is the only country to host an Olympics and not win a gold medal

[ulysses5019]

Like their illegally enhanced women’s swim team.
1976 Women’s swimming results
100 m backstroke
Ulrike Richter East Germany (GDR) 1:01.83
Birgit Treiber East Germany (GDR) 1:03.41
Nancy Garapick Canada (CAN) 1:03.71
200 m backstroke
Ulrike Richter East Germany (GDR) 2:13.43
Birgit Treiber East Germany (GDR) 2:14.97
Nancy Garapick Canada (CAN) 2:15.60
200 m butterfly
Andrea Pollack East Germany (GDR) 2:11.41
Ulrike Tauber East Germany (GDR) 2:12.50
Rosemarie Gabriel East Germany (GDR) 2:12.86
Cheryl Gibson was 4th
400 m individual medley
Ulrike Tauber East Germany (GDR) 4:42.77
Cheryl Gibson Canada (CAN) 4:48.10
Becky Smith Canada (CAN) 4:50.

Shirley Babashoff also lost 4 gold medals losing the 200, 400 and 800 metre freestyle to Kornelia Ender and Petra Thumer.

Mac who is still bitter that Canada is the only country to host an Olympics and not win a gold medal

I'm sorry to learn this piece of trivia and it sucks to lose races to men.