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Re: A Sign of the Times -- Unfortunately
Posted: Fri Nov 19, 2021 1:07 pm
by tlynn78
Bob78164 wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 1:06 pm
Beebs52 wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 12:42 pm
My neurosurgeon told me hospital covid numbers are wonky since they do get paid more per case. But, hey, he's only a doctor.
He's a doctor who's seeing his hospitals fill with COVID patients. As in patients being treated for COVID and dying from it, not merely patients who test positive after being admitted for a different reason. Just like thousands of other doctors across the country whose eyewitness testimony you're ignoring.
Y'all need to learn the concept of error bars. I could believe (with adequate proof, which I haven't seen) that measurement errors mean that California's ratios are off by a bit. But there's no way that the measured numbers are off by so much that California's unvaccinated-to-vaccinated hospitalization and death ratios are remotely close to 1:1. And at least according to the State's Web site, they are measuring people being treated for COVID, not merely people in the hospital for other reasons who test positive. --Bob
"And at least according to the State's Web site,"
LMAO!
Re: A Sign of the Times -- Unfortunately
Posted: Fri Nov 19, 2021 1:10 pm
by Weyoun
Beebs52 wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 12:42 pm
My neurosurgeon told me hospital covid numbers are wonky since they do get paid more per case. But, hey, he's only a doctor.
Did you consider that it is more expensive to treat Covid patients? Even if you’re asymptomatic, you have to do all sorts of isolation precautions. That adds up.
The people who make these points never have to regularly staff a hospital.
And trust me that hospital would much rather have a bunch of neurosurgery patients since they can bill for quite a bit. As that neurosurgeon can tell you
Re: A Sign of the Times -- Unfortunately
Posted: Fri Nov 19, 2021 1:11 pm
by Weyoun
tlynn78 wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 12:19 pm
Weyoun wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 12:09 pm
tlynn78 wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 10:37 am
The problem with statistics is they're only as good as input. Garbage in, garbage out, if you will. My husband was not admitted for any reason related to Covid. He received zero treatment for Covid. But you can be damn sure he showed up in the county's "Covid hospitalizations" statistics.
That seems like supposition.
However most hospitals test admits for Covid for infection control reasons. I think that’s pretty understandable.
You seem to be suggesting a lot of the numbers are inflated. But you can be damn sure they are not.
LOL - okay.
You’re right, it’s totally made up. 750,000 people dead. Thousands of years of life expectancy gone.
All made up because us city folks really get worked up about you Montana folks.
Re: A Sign of the Times -- Unfortunately
Posted: Fri Nov 19, 2021 1:17 pm
by Weyoun
By the way, tlynn is demonstrating the point I made above. She just states flatly that, of course, had her husband had died, we would just call it Covid, just to milk the system for money, presumably. Or to keep the game up somehow.
But that was entirely a hypothetical. What she is so mad about, thankfully, didn’t happen.
But she’s convinced that people out there are “doctoring” numbers and making up stuff, presumably to take advantage of her or the system.
Conspiratorial, paranoid thinking.
Re: A Sign of the Times -- Unfortunately
Posted: Fri Nov 19, 2021 1:18 pm
by tlynn78
Weyoun wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 1:11 pm
tlynn78 wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 12:19 pm
Weyoun wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 12:09 pm
That seems like supposition.
However most hospitals test admits for Covid for infection control reasons. I think that’s pretty understandable.
You seem to be suggesting a lot of the numbers are inflated. But you can be damn sure they are not.
LOL - okay.
You’re right, it’s totally made up. 750,000 people dead. Thousands of years of life expectancy gone.
All made up because us city folks really get worked up about you Montana folks.
I was LOL'ing your 'supposition' comment and to a lesser extent, your being 'damn sure' the numbers aren't inflated. I don't think a single person on here is arguing COVID isn't a real thing. But you do you.
Re: A Sign of the Times -- Unfortunately
Posted: Fri Nov 19, 2021 1:45 pm
by Bob Juch
Weyoun wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 12:09 pm
tlynn78 wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 10:37 am
The problem with statistics is they're only as good as input. Garbage in, garbage out, if you will. My husband was not admitted for any reason related to Covid. He received zero treatment for Covid. But you can be damn sure he showed up in the county's "Covid hospitalizations" statistics.
That seems like supposition.
However most hospitals test admits for Covid for infection control reasons. I think that’s pretty understandable.
You seem to be suggesting a lot of the numbers are inflated. But you can be damn sure they are not.
I wrote here over a year ago that my cardiologist complained to me that COVID deaths were being underreported. He and other doctors were told to put anything except COVID as the cause of death.
The Florida department of health was accused of doing the same thing.
Re: A Sign of the Times -- Unfortunately
Posted: Fri Nov 19, 2021 2:19 pm
by Bob78164
Weyoun wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 1:17 pm
By the way, tlynn is demonstrating the point I made above. She just states flatly that, of course, had her husband had died, we would just call it Covid, just to milk the system for money, presumably. Or to keep the game up somehow.
But that was entirely a hypothetical. What she is so mad about, thankfully, didn’t happen.
But she’s convinced that people out there are “doctoring” numbers and making up stuff, presumably to take advantage of her or the system.
Conspiratorial, paranoid thinking.
She's also demonstrating innumeracy. If Covid-present hospitalizations and deaths not caused by Covid were inflating hospitalization and death numbers, they'd do so for both the vaccinated and the unvaccinated. And under the hypothesis that the vaccines don't help prevent hospitalization or death, they'd do so in proportion to the ratio of vaccinated to unvaccinated in the general population. In other words, an error of that sort can't come close to skewing the numbers the way she's suggesting. --Bob
Re: A Sign of the Times -- Unfortunately
Posted: Fri Nov 19, 2021 5:01 pm
by Beebs52
Bob78164 wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 2:19 pm
Weyoun wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 1:17 pm
By the way, tlynn is demonstrating the point I made above. She just states flatly that, of course, had her husband had died, we would just call it Covid, just to milk the system for money, presumably. Or to keep the game up somehow.
But that was entirely a hypothetical. What she is so mad about, thankfully, didn’t happen.
But she’s convinced that people out there are “doctoring” numbers and making up stuff, presumably to take advantage of her or the system.
Conspiratorial, paranoid thinking.
She's also demonstrating innumeracy. If Covid-present hospitalizations and deaths not caused by Covid were inflating hospitalization and death numbers, they'd do so for both the vaccinated and the unvaccinated. And under the hypothesis that the vaccines don't help prevent hospitalization or death, they'd do so in proportion to the ratio of vaccinated to unvaccinated in the general population. In other words, an error of that sort can't come close to skewing the numbers the way she's suggesting. --Bob
Anecdotally speaking, fuck you both. You have privileged knowledge that hospitals don't conflate numbers? Really? Not inflate, conflate.
Re: A Sign of the Times -- Unfortunately
Posted: Fri Nov 19, 2021 5:16 pm
by Bob78164
Beebs52 wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 5:01 pm
Bob78164 wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 2:19 pm
Weyoun wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 1:17 pm
By the way, tlynn is demonstrating the point I made above. She just states flatly that, of course, had her husband had died, we would just call it Covid, just to milk the system for money, presumably. Or to keep the game up somehow.
But that was entirely a hypothetical. What she is so mad about, thankfully, didn’t happen.
But she’s convinced that people out there are “doctoring” numbers and making up stuff, presumably to take advantage of her or the system.
Conspiratorial, paranoid thinking.
She's also demonstrating innumeracy. If Covid-present hospitalizations and deaths not caused by Covid were inflating hospitalization and death numbers, they'd do so for both the vaccinated and the unvaccinated. And under the hypothesis that the vaccines don't help prevent hospitalization or death, they'd do so in proportion to the ratio of vaccinated to unvaccinated in the general population. In other words, an error of that sort can't come close to skewing the numbers the way she's suggesting. --Bob
Anecdotally speaking, fuck you both. You have privileged knowledge that hospitals don't conflate numbers? Really? Not inflate, conflate.
Nothing privileged about it. Just do the math. There's no way any such errors could throw the RATIOS off that much.
Unless you think the hospitals are ONLY performing such "conflation" for the unvaccinated. In which case, a charge of paranoia appears justified. --Bob
Re: A Sign of the Times -- Unfortunately
Posted: Fri Nov 19, 2021 5:17 pm
by tlynn78
Beebs52 wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 5:01 pm
Bob78164 wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 2:19 pm
Weyoun wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 1:17 pm
By the way, tlynn is demonstrating the point I made above. She just states flatly that, of course, had her husband had died, we would just call it Covid, just to milk the system for money, presumably. Or to keep the game up somehow.
But that was entirely a hypothetical. What she is so mad about, thankfully, didn’t happen.
But she’s convinced that people out there are “doctoring” numbers and making up stuff, presumably to take advantage of her or the system.
Conspiratorial, paranoid thinking.
She's also demonstrating innumeracy. If Covid-present hospitalizations and deaths not caused by Covid were inflating hospitalization and death numbers, they'd do so for both the vaccinated and the unvaccinated. And under the hypothesis that the vaccines don't help prevent hospitalization or death, they'd do so in proportion to the ratio of vaccinated to unvaccinated in the general population. In other words, an error of that sort can't come close to skewing the numbers the way she's suggesting. --Bob
Anecdotally speaking, fuck you both. You have privileged knowledge that hospitals don't conflate numbers? Really? Not inflate, conflate.
You kinda have to feel sorry for them, though, right? I will say, my ego's boosted by Weyoun's apparent belief in my multi-tasking abilities. I mean, not just a crazy, not just paranoid, but a conspiracy theorist, to boot. Don't be jelly, Beebs. And Bob-o, well, let's just say I'd take his medical advice about as quickly as I'd take his legal advice.
Re: A Sign of the Times -- Unfortunately
Posted: Fri Nov 19, 2021 5:24 pm
by Beebs52
I apologize for saying fuck you both. I do that when someone is condescending and dismissive and, wrong.
Re: A Sign of the Times -- Unfortunately
Posted: Fri Nov 19, 2021 5:32 pm
by Beebs52
Re: A Sign of the Times -- Unfortunately
Posted: Fri Nov 19, 2021 5:38 pm
by silverscreenselect
Beebs52 wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 5:24 pm
I apologize for saying fuck you both. I do that when someone is condescending and dismissive and, wrong.
You must have a lot of fun conversations with yourself in the mirror.
Re: A Sign of the Times -- Unfortunately
Posted: Fri Nov 19, 2021 5:46 pm
by tlynn78
silverscreenselect wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 5:38 pm
Beebs52 wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 5:24 pm
I apologize for saying fuck you both. I do that when someone is condescending and dismissive and, wrong.
You must have a lot of fun conversations with yourself in the mirror.
Self-reflection is a skill you might consider trying to develop
Re: A Sign of the Times -- Unfortunately
Posted: Fri Nov 19, 2021 5:52 pm
by Bob78164
That's why I rely on California's numbers, which (a) report hospitalizations CAUSED by Covid, and (b) tell us how many of those patients also were admitted to the ICU. The ratio of ICU patients to total patients hasn't dropped precipitously. --Bob
Re: A Sign of the Times -- Unfortunately
Posted: Fri Nov 19, 2021 5:54 pm
by Beebs52
silverscreenselect wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 5:38 pm
Beebs52 wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 5:24 pm
I apologize for saying fuck you both. I do that when someone is condescending and dismissive and, wrong.
You must have a lot of fun conversations with yourself in the mirror.
You are a piece of work.
Re: A Sign of the Times -- Unfortunately
Posted: Fri Nov 19, 2021 5:58 pm
by Beebs52
Beebs52 wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 5:54 pm
silverscreenselect wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 5:38 pm
Beebs52 wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 5:24 pm
I apologize for saying fuck you both. I do that when someone is condescending and dismissive and, wrong.
You must have a lot of fun conversations with yourself in the mirror.
You are a piece of work.
Thanks for acknowledging my fuck you. It wasn't directed at you, but you may have one, too. For which I won't apologize.
Re: A Sign of the Times -- Unfortunately
Posted: Fri Nov 19, 2021 6:29 pm
by silverscreenselect
Beebs52 wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 5:58 pm
silverscreenselect wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 5:38 pm
I apologize for saying fuck you both. I do that when someone is condescending and dismissive and, wrong.
You must have a lot of fun conversations with yourself in the mirror.
Thanks for acknowledging my fuck you. It wasn't directed at you, but you may have one, too. For which I won't apologize.
So, either I'm not condescending, not dismissive, or not wrong. Thanks.
Re: A Sign of the Times -- Unfortunately
Posted: Fri Nov 19, 2021 6:46 pm
by Estonut
silverscreenselect wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 6:29 pm
Beebs52 wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 5:58 pm
silverscreenselect wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 5:38 pm
You must have a lot of fun conversations with yourself in the mirror.
Thanks for acknowledging my fuck you. It wasn't directed at you, but you may have one, too. For which I won't apologize.
So, either I'm not condescending, not dismissive, or not wrong. Thanks.
Read it again, bonehead!
Edited to fix SSS' faulty quoting.
Re: A Sign of the Times -- Unfortunately
Posted: Fri Nov 19, 2021 6:46 pm
by Beebs52
silverscreenselect wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 6:29 pm
Beebs52 wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 5:58 pm
silverscreenselect wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 5:38 pm
I apologize for saying fuck you both. I do that when someone is condescending and dismissive and, wrong.
You must have a lot of fun conversations with yourself in the mirror.
Thanks for acknowledging my fuck you. It wasn't directed at you, but you may have one, too. For which I won't apologize.
So, either I'm not condescending, not dismissive, or not wrong. Thanks.
Just a Richardhead.
Re: A Sign of the Times -- Unfortunately
Posted: Sat Nov 20, 2021 11:17 am
by Bob Juch
Cuomo misrepresented COVID-19 nursing home toll, report says
https://abc7ny.com/gov-andrew-cuomo-nur ... /11256654/
Others in other areas probably did the same.
Re: A Sign of the Times -- Unfortunately
Posted: Sat Nov 20, 2021 5:54 pm
by Weyoun
Beebs52 wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 5:24 pm
I apologize for saying fuck you both. I do that when someone is condescending and dismissive and, wrong.
You must talk to yourself a lot, then. Do people look at you funny?
Re: A Sign of the Times -- Unfortunately
Posted: Sat Nov 20, 2021 6:42 pm
by Beebs52
Weyoun wrote: ↑Sat Nov 20, 2021 5:54 pm
Beebs52 wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 5:24 pm
I apologize for saying fuck you both. I do that when someone is condescending and dismissive and, wrong.
You must talk to yourself a lot, then. Do people look at you funny?
You're late to the party. In re response to sss.
Re: A Sign of the Times -- Unfortunately
Posted: Sat Nov 20, 2021 6:50 pm
by BackInTex
I'm shocked. Shocked I tell you!
BTW, do you think any of those doing or complicit in the misrepresenting are MDs?
Re: A Sign of the Times -- Unfortunately
Posted: Sat Nov 20, 2021 7:10 pm
by Bob Juch
BackInTex wrote: ↑Sat Nov 20, 2021 6:50 pm
I'm shocked. Shocked I tell you!
BTW, do you think any of those doing or complicit in the misrepresenting are MDs?
I know they are. They were ordered to do so by their management.