A Covid Prediction If Biden Wins

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Spock
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A Covid Prediction If Biden Wins

#1 Post by Spock » Fri Oct 30, 2020 1:39 pm

I know that many on my side of the aisle expect that there will be an endless series of lockdowns and so forth. Many on the left here might also be expecting more restrictive regulations.

Sometimes I lean that way, but then I remember how Covid concerns seemed to evaporate among the left and MSM early this summer during the riots/protests/marches etc. So, I am going the other way with my prediction.

At the time of the riots/protests/marches it was not useful to use Covid as a hammer against Trump-It was basically "Covid? What Covid? There is nothing to see there."

I note how often CNN/MSNBC etc mention the Sturgis Bike Rally when they mention South Dakota, but they completely ignore the nationwide protests.

I predict that shortly after Biden's Inauguration-when Covid is no longer useful as a hammer against Trump-It will essentially be "Covid? What Covid? There is nothing to see there" again. And it will happen so fast that it will make your head spin and the usual suspects here will follow right along with it.

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Re: A Covid Prediction If Biden Wins

#2 Post by Spock » Fri Oct 30, 2020 3:55 pm

Wow-this started even sooner than I thought.

NYT story that dropped the Friday before the election when it can have absolutely no impact. I don't have access to NYT-but I got the main blurb. Obviously, laying the groundwork for the shift to "Covid? What Covid? There is nothing to see there" during the early days of the Biden Admin.
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
"Virus Hospitalizations are up in NYC, But This Time It is Different."

>>>"Patients with serious cases are spending less time in the hospital and are less likely to be put on ventilators. Fewer are dying."

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

The obvious corollary to my prediction is that we will start seeing high-profile stories about the harm that lockdowns do.

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Re: A Covid Prediction If Biden Wins

#3 Post by jaybee » Fri Oct 30, 2020 8:35 pm

Pointing out the obvious here: It's a virus. It doesn't give a fuck what your politics are. It doesn't give a fuck how many opinion pieces are floated across media and it certainly doesn't give a fuck if anyone wants to cherry pick stats from one place or another to 'prove' their point. If we expect to fight it and eventually defeat it everyone - and I mean everyone - has to apply what we are learning about Covid 19.

Will Covid continue to be weaponized by some in both parties - sure, there's ignorant assholes everywhere. So as long as even just 10% to 20% of the population tries to ignore Covid, or treat it like "just the flu" or rationalize that it's not so bad if more people die from cancer, car wrecks, malaria or whatever cause of death they want to choose to support their viewpoint - then Covid will continue in multiple waves and eventually kill those millions of Americans that we were warned about months ago.

The really stupid thing is is that we are actually starting to figure things out and while it's going to be very difficult to defeat Covid the steps that we can take to at least get it to manageable numbers are fairly simple:

1. Limit the number of people that you have close contact with.
2. Social distance and wear your damn mask
3. Just don't even go to any large gatherings - especially indoors

It seems insanely simple and doesn't require shutting the country down to work. What it does require is for everyone to be on board. All those who feel that their right to not take these simple steps are more important are just adding to the problem and are definitely not a part of the solution. You would think that Covid would like these people better but again, it's a virus and just doesn't give a fuck - it will infect you, possibly kill or disable you and certainly enable you to infect others no matter how left or right you lean.

Our area has been under a 'mandatory" mask requirement for months now. Frankly, it's a joke and has no chance of working. Not because it isn't a good plan, but because too many choose to ignore it and nobody is willing to truly make it mandatory. The result is that there are 20% - 40% who are choosing to ignore the virus and refuse to take many steps to stop it. But they are doing a great job at keeping the rest of the country infected. As much as I'd like to, I really can't put too much blame on those who are living their life and spreading Covid. Our leadership from the top down is weak or nonexistent. Without leadership people tend to follow what other people do - it's just human nature. But in the meantime it would be a great start if people would start thinking less about themselves and more about the fact that we will only get ahead of this thing if our priorities are for everyone else that we may come into contact with.
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Re: A Covid Prediction If Biden Wins

#4 Post by franktangredi » Sat Oct 31, 2020 10:25 am

My sister - as dedicated a doctor as you could want to meet - texted me yesterday, "crying with rage" over Trump's comments about doctors inflating COVID numbers. If you go along with that, go f**k yourself.

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Re: A Covid Prediction If Biden Wins

#5 Post by jaybee » Sat Oct 31, 2020 10:58 am

Exactly!

Given the choice between:

A) Hundreds of thousands of medical professionals all in all 50 states and all over the world are conspiring to alter the numbers of Covid infections, hospitalizations and deaths so they can get some of that "Covid" money for themselves.

or

B) Trump is lying in a desperate attempt to stroke his own ego and gather votes for his desperate attempt to get re-elected.


I believe I've got to go with 'B'
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Re: A Covid Prediction If Biden Wins

#6 Post by silverscreenselect » Sat Oct 31, 2020 12:10 pm

Spock wrote:
Fri Oct 30, 2020 3:55 pm
Wow-this started even sooner than I thought.

NYT story that dropped the Friday before the election when it can have absolutely no impact. I don't have access to NYT-but I got the main blurb. Obviously, laying the groundwork for the shift to "Covid? What Covid? There is nothing to see there" during the early days of the Biden Admin.
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
"Virus Hospitalizations are up in NYC, But This Time It is Different."

>>>"Patients with serious cases are spending less time in the hospital and are less likely to be put on ventilators. Fewer are dying."
This is not some sort of prelude to an attempt to minimize the virus. It's an attempt to explain why we're not seeing 2500-3000 deaths a day as we were in April despite more cases. The simple explanation is that as we learn more about the virus, sometimes by trial and error, we learn better ways to treat patients who are in hospitals. Doctors are less likely now to put patients on ventilators than they were back then, preferring less intrusive methods of treatment. One very simple measure they found was that laying patients on their stomachs made it easier to treat them.

We are making progress in treating patients once they get in the hospital. And thanks to increased testing, more patients are getting hospitalized earlier. So the death rates are going down while infection rates are going up. But unless you're someone like Spock or Trump Jr. who feels that being in intensive care for a couple of weeks is no big deal because you didn't die, this increasing caseload is a very serious matter for the nation's health now and in the future. We still have no idea if there are any longterm effects for people who have been infected. Side effects that manifest themselves 1-2 years down the road in even 5-10% of these patients could devastate our healthcare system.

If Biden wins, it will be because people expect him to do something about the virus, not become Trump #2 and simply ignore it to push through the AOC-Bernie Sanders agenda. He's certainly going to put responsible people in the task force instead of political hacks (goodbye Scott Atlas) and have high level politicians (himself or Harris) actively coordinate. He'll also coordinate testing and contact tracing efforts.

I expect you'll also see a lot of public service announcements from Republicans about following CDC guidelines on masking, social distancing, and the like.
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Re: A Covid Prediction If Biden Wins

#7 Post by Spock » Sat Oct 31, 2020 4:36 pm

franktangredi wrote:
Sat Oct 31, 2020 10:25 am
My sister - as dedicated a doctor as you could want to meet - texted me yesterday, "crying with rage" over Trump's comments about doctors inflating COVID numbers. If you go along with that, go f**k yourself.
Are you raging over the recent superspreader events in Philly?

BTW-I am not minimizing the virus. I am just noting a pattern and making a prediction. When Covid was not useful to attack Trump this summer during the marches/protests/riots-it seemed to drop right off the radar screen. Sturgis is deemed useful to attack Governor Noem-but nary a mention of the marches.

Endless lockdowns and continuing Covid panics will not be deemed helpful to a Biden Administration by the MSM and TPTB.

One interesting test will be the plethora of events surrounding Biden's Inauguration.

Will the socially-distanced white circles that we all know and love from the Biden campaign events be making an appearance then, or are they just handy campaign theater and destined for the memory hole?

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Re: A Covid Prediction If Biden Wins

#8 Post by Spock » Sat Oct 31, 2020 5:33 pm

I note how furious people are with me for merely making a prediction. If I am correct, I would expect all of you to be far more furious with the Biden Admin, the MSM and the various TPTB.

One swallow does not make a spring, but look back at the NYT story that I referenced early in this thread.

How many MSM stories have we seen about how things are not as bad as they were etc? Why don't you take up some of your fury with the NYT story? Nobody sees my shit here-but NYT has a pretty wide distribution.

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Re: A Covid Prediction If Biden Wins

#9 Post by jaybee » Sat Oct 31, 2020 8:03 pm

When Covid was not useful to attack Trump this summer during the marches/protests/riots-it seemed to drop right off the radar screen.

Now I'll admit that I for one am sick and tired of Covid and hearing about Covid. But for the life of me I cannot recall anytime in the last 8 months where Covid, and attacks against Trumps handling of Covid "dropped right off the radar screen". Between all of the many of our Presidents predictions of how quickly Covid will be gone - 'It's only 15 people, under 40, maybe 10,000 will die", 'Everything will open up by Easter", As soon as Summer gets here it's over", The famous bleach thing, Too many refusals to listen to experts to mention or count, "I am not responsible", A self appointed 10 of 10 rating and using the position and power of the President of the United States to influence untold millions to not follow common sense safety guidelines - leading to God knows how many new cases and more deaths. Between all of that massive amount of incompetency from our President, this topic has stayed in the news. All. Year. Long.

If you have missed it, then I'm afraid that you have become a victim of your own desire to believe what you want to believe and are dismissing anything that doesn't fit what you want to see. Sorry if that sounds harsh but really - go back and search for headlines and news from the Summer "off the radar period" that you are seeing. You'll find that attacks against Trump for his handling of the Covid 19 crises have been relentless. In the words of our President, "Covid, Covid, Covid, Covid, Covid - it's all you hear about"

Now of course, we have had other news and due to the nature of news something that is "new" is going to take the top headlines. So if there happens to be a cop who chokes a man to death, or unarmed people getting shot, out of control riots, hurricanes, kidnap attempts against a sitting Governor, armed militia out in public surrounding government buildings and of course a national election - then you'll find that Covid and attacks against the President about Covid, may be reduced to being below the fold or only the third or fourth story on the nightly news.

As I've referenced elsewhere - Covid does not give a fuck. We either find a way to control it or we don't. Currently we are losing. Currently we do not have the ability to manipulate the severity of Covid to be used as a tool against the President. Yes, Covid is used as one of the many failures of Trump in an effort to deny him reelection - as it should be. How else are we expected to judge our elected leaders? So yes, here a few days before the election when we hear our President spew lies about "turning the corner" and "people are not dying from Covid" while looking out our window to see not only the numbers of people getting sick going up, people seriously sick enough to be hospitalized and people dying in higher and higher numbers - yes, that is going to be used to attack the President. But unfortunately this disease and our failure to control it has and will remain in the headlines.
Jaybee

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Re: A Covid Prediction If Biden Wins

#10 Post by Ritterskoop » Sat Oct 31, 2020 8:39 pm

Broadcaster the other night (sorry I was flipping channels, and don't know which one), responding to "turning the corner":

Which corner? The coffin corner?




Look, I am not always on board with using Number of Cases as a measurement of anything, although it does seem to have a valid correlation to a thing three weeks later, which I DO believe is accurate, which is Number of Deaths. Hospital beds and deaths, you can't misinterpret. Coroners don't get paid any more one way or the other.
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Re: A Covid Prediction If Biden Wins

#11 Post by Bob78164 » Sat Oct 31, 2020 8:42 pm

Ritterskoop wrote:
Sat Oct 31, 2020 8:39 pm
Broadcaster the other night (sorry I was flipping channels, and don't know which one), responding to "turning the corner":

Which corner? The coffin corner?




Look, I am not always on board with using Number of Cases as a measurement of anything, although it does seem to have a valid correlation to a thing three weeks later, which I DO believe is accurate, which is Number of Deaths. Hospital beds and deaths, you can't misinterpret. Coroners don't get paid any more one way or the other.
I've been using hospitalizations. Data shows up sooner there, and the data is pretty hard to misinterpret even for people who are motivated to do so. --Bob
"Question with boldness even the existence of a God; because, if there be one, he must more approve of the homage of reason than that of blindfolded fear." Thomas Jefferson

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Re: A Covid Prediction If Biden Wins

#12 Post by jaybee » Sun Nov 01, 2020 1:52 am

I've been tracking just deaths, as it's hard to argue that these dead people volunteered to be a part of a conspiracy. So I've been tracking deaths just in the state of Tennessee. In July we had 424 die. That's 14 per day. August was 714. 23 per day. September was 673. Just under 23 per day. October jumped to 931. 30 per day. To 'celebrate' Halloween we lost 88 Tennesseans to Covid in just one day.
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Re: A Covid Prediction If Biden Wins

#13 Post by Spock » Mon Nov 02, 2020 9:21 am

It will be interesting to see the social distancing protocols in action at the left's "Steal the Vote" rallies slated for Wednesday.

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Re: A Covid Prediction If Biden Wins

#14 Post by Spock » Mon Nov 02, 2020 9:24 am

jaybee wrote:
Sun Nov 01, 2020 1:52 am
I've been tracking just deaths, as it's hard to argue that these dead people volunteered to be a part of a conspiracy. So I've been tracking deaths just in the state of Tennessee. In July we had 424 die. That's 14 per day. August was 714. 23 per day. September was 673. Just under 23 per day. October jumped to 931. 30 per day. To 'celebrate' Halloween we lost 88 Tennesseans to Covid in just one day.
For the 3rd time-or whatever in this thread-I am not asserting that it is a conspiracy.

I am merely noting a pattern and making a prediction.

Covid concerns tend to disappear when they are not useful as a hammer against Trump and Republicans.

Where were the Covid concerns during the massive marches/protests/riots early this summer?

Why does Sturgis get repeatedly mentioned months after the event-but nothing about the marches?

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Re: A Covid Prediction If Biden Wins

#15 Post by silverscreenselect » Mon Nov 02, 2020 9:42 am

Spock wrote:
Mon Nov 02, 2020 9:24 am
Why does Sturgis get repeatedly mentioned months after the event-but nothing about the marches?
Well, perhaps because (a) people at the marches were more inclined to wear masks, and (b) there's been documented evidence that ties numerous coronavirus cases to the Sturgis event. Also, people didn't just ride through Sturgis on their motorcycles. They spent a lot of time in stores, bars, restaurants, and other gathering places. My guess would be that many of those locales were filled at or near capacity a good bit of the time. (Sturgis is a town of about 7,000 people.)

And while we're on that subject:

Trump campaign rallies led to more than 30,000 coronavirus cases, Stanford researchers say
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Re: A Covid Prediction If Biden Wins

#16 Post by earendel » Mon Nov 02, 2020 10:10 am

Spock wrote:
Sat Oct 31, 2020 5:33 pm
I note how furious people are with me for merely making a prediction. If I am correct, I would expect all of you to be far more furious with the Biden Admin, the MSM and the various TPTB.
A prediction, or a parroting of Trump? He's been saying this for weeks.
"Elen sila lumenn omentielvo...A star shines on the hour of our meeting."

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Re: A Covid Prediction If Biden Wins

#17 Post by Spock » Mon Nov 02, 2020 1:47 pm

I hope people get the main direction I believe that things will go under a Biden Admin. However, since he has to give the Karens something-it looks like he might institute a national outdoor mask mandate.

Yeah, that sounds like a wise "Follow the Science" policy. Blocking people off from Vitamin D-Good luck with that, I guess.

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Re: A Covid Prediction If Biden Wins

#18 Post by Bob78164 » Mon Nov 02, 2020 1:50 pm

Spock wrote:
Mon Nov 02, 2020 1:47 pm
Blocking people off from Vitamin D-Good luck with that, I guess.
Okay. You've convinced me. You're not just trolling us. You really are that stupid.

How much Vitamin D do you imagine a mask would block? --Bob
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Re: A Covid Prediction If Biden Wins

#19 Post by Spock » Mon Nov 02, 2020 1:51 pm

silverscreenselect wrote:
Mon Nov 02, 2020 9:42 am
Spock wrote:
Mon Nov 02, 2020 9:24 am
Why does Sturgis get repeatedly mentioned months after the event-but nothing about the marches?
Well, perhaps because (a) people at the marches were more inclined to wear masks, and (b) there's been documented evidence that ties numerous coronavirus cases to the Sturgis event. Also, people didn't just ride through Sturgis on their motorcycles. They spent a lot of time in stores, bars, restaurants, and other gathering places. My guess would be that many of those locales were filled at or near capacity a good bit of the time. (Sturgis is a town of about 7,000 people.)

And while we're on that subject:

Trump campaign rallies led to more than 30,000 coronavirus cases, Stanford researchers say
Yeah, 10 people can't get together and sing quietly in a church wearing masks-but hundreds or thousands can yell and spit at the police.

You make my point exactly, Right-wing things "spread" the disease but left-wing things don't. Large groups of people matter, except when they don't.

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Re: A Covid Prediction If Biden Wins

#20 Post by Spock » Mon Nov 02, 2020 2:32 pm

earendel wrote:
Mon Nov 02, 2020 10:10 am
Spock wrote:
Sat Oct 31, 2020 5:33 pm
I note how furious people are with me for merely making a prediction. If I am correct, I would expect all of you to be far more furious with the Biden Admin, the MSM and the various TPTB.
A prediction, or a parroting of Trump? He's been saying this for weeks.
Really??? After 20 years, we are at the level of "You are just parroting Trump" from Earendel?

No benefit of the doubt? Nothing?

What in the hell is wrong with this place.

It obviously doesn't matter to anyone, but, no, I wasn't parroting Trump.

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Re: A Covid Prediction If Biden Wins

#21 Post by silverscreenselect » Mon Nov 02, 2020 3:51 pm

Spock wrote:
Mon Nov 02, 2020 2:32 pm
Really??? After 20 years, we are at the level of "You are just parroting Trump" from Earendel?

No benefit of the doubt? Nothing?
I suppose you both could be parroting the same debunked right wing source.

By the way, do you have some documentation as to the amount of Covid spread due to the protests? The doctors and scientists who are trying to stop the spread of this disease aren't acting on behalf of Joe Biden. They are using their best medical judgment in trying to keep people alive and healthy. You're just promoting a political point of view that doesn't have much scientific support.
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Re: A Covid Prediction If Biden Wins

#22 Post by Spock » Tue Nov 03, 2020 5:55 pm

Nice of the New York Times to tell us this today.

>>>"Nine months and more than 1.1 million deaths later, there is still no transparent, independent investigation into the source of the virus. Notoriously allergic to outside scrutiny, China has impeded the effort, while leaders of the World Health Organization, if privately frustrated, have largely ceded control,"<<<<<

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/11/02/worl ... ticleShare

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Re: A Covid Prediction If Biden Wins

#23 Post by Weyoun » Thu Nov 05, 2020 10:38 am

Spock wrote:
Fri Oct 30, 2020 1:39 pm
I know that many on my side of the aisle expect that there will be an endless series of lockdowns and so forth. Many on the left here might also be expecting more restrictive regulations.

Sometimes I lean that way, but then I remember how Covid concerns seemed to evaporate among the left and MSM early this summer during the riots/protests/marches etc. So, I am going the other way with my prediction.

At the time of the riots/protests/marches it was not useful to use Covid as a hammer against Trump-It was basically "Covid? What Covid? There is nothing to see there."

I note how often CNN/MSNBC etc mention the Sturgis Bike Rally when they mention South Dakota, but they completely ignore the nationwide protests.

I predict that shortly after Biden's Inauguration-when Covid is no longer useful as a hammer against Trump-It will essentially be "Covid? What Covid? There is nothing to see there" again. And it will happen so fast that it will make your head spin and the usual suspects here will follow right along with it.
As a doctor on the front lines of this - and a lifelong Republican who cautiously voted for Biden - I feel the need to say that I am really embarrassed for you by your comments here.

You used to have a perspective about life that I found refreshingly different, and I enjoyed reading your posts - back in the day.

This conspiracy mongering nonsense, obscuration of facts, and the minimizing of human suffering is beneath you, or at least the person who posted five years ago.

Steve Perry

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Re: A Covid Prediction If Biden Wins

#24 Post by silverscreenselect » Thu Nov 05, 2020 10:49 am

Weyoun wrote:
Thu Nov 05, 2020 10:38 am
Spock wrote:
Fri Oct 30, 2020 1:39 pm
I know that many on my side of the aisle expect that there will be an endless series of lockdowns and so forth. Many on the left here might also be expecting more restrictive regulations.

Sometimes I lean that way, but then I remember how Covid concerns seemed to evaporate among the left and MSM early this summer during the riots/protests/marches etc. So, I am going the other way with my prediction.

At the time of the riots/protests/marches it was not useful to use Covid as a hammer against Trump-It was basically "Covid? What Covid? There is nothing to see there."

I note how often CNN/MSNBC etc mention the Sturgis Bike Rally when they mention South Dakota, but they completely ignore the nationwide protests.

I predict that shortly after Biden's Inauguration-when Covid is no longer useful as a hammer against Trump-It will essentially be "Covid? What Covid? There is nothing to see there" again. And it will happen so fast that it will make your head spin and the usual suspects here will follow right along with it.
As a doctor on the front lines of this - and a lifelong Republican who cautiously voted for Biden - I feel the need to say that I am really embarrassed for you by your comments here.

You used to have a perspective about life that I found refreshingly different, and I enjoyed reading your posts - back in the day.

This conspiracy mongering nonsense, obscuration of facts, and the minimizing of human suffering is beneath you, or at least the person who posted five years ago.

Steve Perry
Glad to see you back on the Bored. Especially glad to read this post.

We usually hear from politicians, not people who deal with this disease first hand.
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Re: A Covid Prediction If Biden Wins

#25 Post by Bob78164 » Thu Nov 05, 2020 11:53 am

Weyoun wrote:
Thu Nov 05, 2020 10:38 am
As a doctor on the front lines of this . . . .

Steve Perry
Thank you for your service. --Bob
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