Blog discussing TDC

[MarleysGh0st]

There's an About.com blog discussing The Damned Clock. Are any of the posters BBs we'd know here by a different name?

http://gameshows.about.com/b/2009/03/12 ... -money.htm

[clem21]

I'll repeat what I've said before:

If you let the clock get to you then it will. If you have a clear mind then you can make clear decisions in the time you've got. As I've said 30 and 45 seconds seems like a pretty long time when you're sitting in the hot seat. Especially when you consider that you've got less than that on the original audition test that all contestants take. So to be honest, if anyone on that blog (or anyone else) blames their own failures on the clock, they lose respect in my eyes. Man up, accept that you messed up and stop blaming your failures on others. My thoughts are similar with ATE; IMHO people need to take responsibility for their own actions. This is how the game is, so do your best and stop complaining.

[MarleysGh0st]

As I've said 30 and 45 seconds seems like a pretty long time when you're sitting in the hot seat.

Nonetheless, there are questions on WWTBAM that can be figured out, but doing that figuring (and retrieving obscure related facts from memory) can take time. Longer than 30 or 45 seconds, even. TPTB may still ask those types of questions, but contestants aren't given the time to work them out. And we, the viewers, no longer get the chance to follow those thought processes, which used to be one of the unique aspects of this trivia show, compared to all the others.

Especially when you consider that you've got less than that on the original audition test that all contestants take.

But you're not risking it all on an individual question on the written test.

So to be honest, if anyone on that blog (or anyone else) blames their own failures on the clock, they lose respect in my eyes. Man up, accept that you messed up and stop blaming your failures on others.

We're saying the game has been changed, and not for the better.

My thoughts are similar with ATE; IMHO people need to take responsibility for their own actions. This is how the game is, so do your best and stop complaining.

We're saying the game has been changed, and not for the better.

[Bob Juch]

I was in the HS at DCA twelve times and the clock never gave me a problem.

[MarleysGh0st]

I was in the HS at DCA twelve times and the clock never gave me a problem.

How many of those times were you risking $1 million on your decision?

[clem21]

As I've said 30 and 45 seconds seems like a pretty long time when you're sitting in the hot seat.

Nonetheless, there are questions on WWTBAM that can be figured out, but doing that figuring (and retrieving obscure related facts from memory) can take time. Longer than 30 or 45 seconds, even. TPTB may still ask those types of questions, but contestants aren't given the time to work them out. And we, the viewers, no longer get the chance to follow those thought processes, which used to be one of the unique aspects of this trivia show, compared to all the others.

Especially when you consider that you've got less than that on the original audition test that all contestants take.

But you're not risking it all on an individual question on the written test.

So to be honest, if anyone on that blog (or anyone else) blames their own failures on the clock, they lose respect in my eyes. Man up, accept that you messed up and stop blaming your failures on others.

We're saying the game has been changed, and not for the better.

My thoughts are similar with ATE; IMHO people need to take responsibility for their own actions. This is how the game is, so do your best and stop complaining.

We're saying the game has been changed, and not for the better.

That's not what one of the commentators on the blog was saying. I thought that's what you were pointing out.

Also, it seems to me that they've cut down on the "figure-it-out" sort of questions in favor of the simpler kind. I don't think it makes the game worse. I think it makes it different. There is a definite uptick in drama and pace in this new version. Honestly, I've been watching some of the older games on GSN and quite frankly I get bored. A lot. This could be because I have the attention span of a flea on crack but there you go....

[ulysses5019]

As I've said 30 and 45 seconds seems like a pretty long time when you're sitting in the hot seat.

Nonetheless, there are questions on WWTBAM that can be figured out, but doing that figuring (and retrieving obscure related facts from memory) can take time. Longer than 30 or 45 seconds, even. TPTB may still ask those types of questions, but contestants aren't given the time to work them out. And we, the viewers, no longer get the chance to follow those thought processes, which used to be one of the unique aspects of this trivia show, compared to all the others.

Especially when you consider that you've got less than that on the original audition test that all contestants take.

But you're not risking it all on an individual question on the written test.

So to be honest, if anyone on that blog (or anyone else) blames their own failures on the clock, they lose respect in my eyes. Man up, accept that you messed up and stop blaming your failures on others.

We're saying the game has been changed, and not for the better.

My thoughts are similar with ATE; IMHO people need to take responsibility for their own actions. This is how the game is, so do your best and stop complaining.

We're saying the game has been changed, and not for the better.

That's not what one of the commentators on the blog was saying. I thought that's what you were pointing out.

Also, it seems to me that they've cut down on the "figure-it-out" sort of questions in favor of the simpler kind. I don't think it makes the game worse. I think it makes it different. There is a definite uptick in drama and pace in this new version. Honestly, I've been watching some of the older games on GSN and quite frankly I get bored. A lot. This could be because I have the attention span of a flea on crack but there you go....

So, are you saying that the original version of BAM, including the phone game qualifying, is the boring version of the show?

[clem21]

Nonetheless, there are questions on WWTBAM that can be figured out, but doing that figuring (and retrieving obscure related facts from memory) can take time. Longer than 30 or 45 seconds, even. TPTB may still ask those types of questions, but contestants aren't given the time to work them out. And we, the viewers, no longer get the chance to follow those thought processes, which used to be one of the unique aspects of this trivia show, compared to all the others.


But you're not risking it all on an individual question on the written test.
We're saying the game has been changed, and not for the better.
We're saying the game has been changed, and not for the better.

That's not what one of the commentators on the blog was saying. I thought that's what you were pointing out.

Also, it seems to me that they've cut down on the "figure-it-out" sort of questions in favor of the simpler kind. I don't think it makes the game worse. I think it makes it different. There is a definite uptick in drama and pace in this new version. Honestly, I've been watching some of the older games on GSN and quite frankly I get bored. A lot. This could be because I have the attention span of a flea on crack but there you go....

So, are you saying that the original version of BAM, including the phone game qualifying, is the boring version of the show?

And here's the part where I die.

I enjoy the chit-chat. I enjoy the celebrities. I enjoy the extra drama provided by the clock.

So yes, that's exactly what I'm saying.

[ulysses5019]

That's not what one of the commentators on the blog was saying. I thought that's what you were pointing out.

Also, it seems to me that they've cut down on the "figure-it-out" sort of questions in favor of the simpler kind. I don't think it makes the game worse. I think it makes it different. There is a definite uptick in drama and pace in this new version. Honestly, I've been watching some of the older games on GSN and quite frankly I get bored. A lot. This could be because I have the attention span of a flea on crack but there you go....

So, are you saying that the original version of BAM, including the phone game qualifying, is the boring version of the show?

And here's the part where I die.

I enjoy the chit-chat. I enjoy the celebrities. I enjoy the extra drama provided by the clock.

So yes, that's exactly what I'm saying.

Don't worry, marley is on a gh0st.

[TheCalvinator24]

There is a definite uptick in drama and pace in this new version. Honestly, I've been watching some of the older games on GSN and quite frankly I get bored. A lot. This could be because I have the attention span of a flea on crack but there you go....

For me, the drama is less under the new format. In fact, the show has become completely unwatchable for me.

[thealexdavis]

I wrote on my site, and I think it's true, that the clock truly doesn't affect the game for 14 of the 15 questions. I'm assuming 14 of the 15 questions because we haven't seen a million dollar question this season, nor will we most likely, but it has the time bank. The show's been giving away an unusual amount of money this season; tons of $250,000 winners. It seems to make the people wavering on the quarter mil question, deciding whether to risk the $75,000, to make up their minds and go with their gut instinct.

It really hurts the show, though, because you will see even less $500,000 winners and million dollar questions than before. No one can make a calculated $225,000 gamble in 45 seconds. The only way you're going to get someone to get to the final question is if that person is 100% sure from that person's self or a lifeline (which is going to be incredibly rare) or you have a crazy-ass gambler that meant to go to the Deal or No Deal set. I don't think we would have seen Ogi's unbelievable $500K win which is my favorite moment, bar none, in the history of the show (he can verify it if he's around, haha). We wouldn't have seen Jeff Gross's half mil win. I don't think we would have seen many.

I really think the show would benefit from having a checkpoint-style clock system next season. Keep the same base time on each question, but any left over time from the last question gets carried to the next one. That or do something with the upper tier time limit. I'd never think I'd get sick of $250,000 winners. I'm really not one of those people who craves big winners constantly, but it's time. I get constant emails from readers who think it's just about impossible to win.

[secondchance]

To me, TDC and all the non-question-related chit chat has made the show kinda cheesy. Hearing the contestants' thought process about the answers used to be intriguing.

And, how does anyone within TPTB imagine it's fair to start the clock before the answer choices have finished being read... I mean, really?

[thealexdavis]

To me, TDC and all the non-question-related chit chat has made the show kinda cheesy. Hearing the contestants' thought process about the answers used to be intriguing.

And, how does anyone within TPTB imagine it's fair to start the clock before the answer choices have finished being read... I mean, really?

Someone can correct me if I'm wrong but you have full rights to answer the question as soon as the answers appear on the screen. I was told that's the specific reason the answers appear all at once and the clock makes a tone once it begins is so people can answer instantly. No one really does it for some inexplicable reason. I don't know if it's because of the phenomenon that the show was that people are conditioned to not answer until all the choices have been read or they are just too polite, but whatever. I was also told that literally no one has interrupted Meredith yet. Hopefully the more familiar people get with it, the more they'll start to interrupt. But you still have to get past that quarter million dollar question which is going to be really hard.

[secondchance]

To me, TDC and all the non-question-related chit chat has made the show kinda cheesy. Hearing the contestants' thought process about the answers used to be intriguing.

And, how does anyone within TPTB imagine it's fair to start the clock before the answer choices have finished being read... I mean, really?

Someone can correct me if I'm wrong but you have full rights to answer the question as soon as the answers appear on the screen. I was told that's the specific reason the answers appear all at once and the clock makes a tone once it begins is so people can answer instantly. No one really does it for some inexplicable reason. I don't know if it's because of the phenomenon that the show was that people are conditioned to not answer until all the choices have been read or they are just too polite, but whatever. I was also told that literally no one has interrupted Meredith yet. Hopefully the more familiar people get with it, the more they'll start to interrupt. But you still have to get past that quarter million dollar question which is going to be really hard.

I really think the show would benefit from having a checkpoint-style clock system next season. Keep the same base time on each question, but any left over time from the last question gets carried to the next one.

I believe it was Frogman who said that he was instructed not to interrupt Meredith while she was still reading the answers. Several former contestants did discuss this a while back...


I think your checkpoint-style clock system idea is a good one.

[TheConfessor]

To me, TDC and all the non-question-related chit chat has made the show kinda cheesy. Hearing the contestants' thought process about the answers used to be intriguing.

And, how does anyone within TPTB imagine it's fair to start the clock before the answer choices have finished being read... I mean, really?

Someone can correct me if I'm wrong but you have full rights to answer the question as soon as the answers appear on the screen. I was told that's the specific reason the answers appear all at once and the clock makes a tone once it begins is so people can answer instantly. No one really does it for some inexplicable reason. I don't know if it's because of the phenomenon that the show was that people are conditioned to not answer until all the choices have been read or they are just too polite, but whatever. I was also told that literally no one has interrupted Meredith yet. Hopefully the more familiar people get with it, the more they'll start to interrupt. But you still have to get past that quarter million dollar question which is going to be really hard.

Contestants who have appeared this season have reported that they were told, officially, that they are allowed to interrupt Meredith, but they are encouraged not to. I think they were told that it might be hard to understand what was said if both people are talking at once, but that was never an issue when we had the clock on Grand Slam. The incentive to interrupt is much greater on Grand Slam than on WWTBAM. On WWTBAM, I think the clock is usually just another distraction or annoyance, whereas on Grand Slam, it is the crux of the game.

The clock certainly complicates a contestant's decision making process when the dollar amount rises high enough to be life-changing money, but I don't think that effect just suddenly kicks with at the $500K question. Each contestant has a different threshold at which they are no longer willing to take a risk. For a lot of them, that seems to come much earlier, often on the $16K or $25K question. I assume the show tries to screen out most of the really smart players who are not risk-averse, just to protect their budget.

I think the biggest impact of the clock is that certain types of questions can no longer be asked, because they required a systematic approach to derive the correct answer. You can't really ask how many state capitals have four-syllable names, or how fast is 60 miles/hour, converted to furlongs per fortnight. With 45 seconds or less, the questions need to be mostly about facts that you either know or you don't, not stuff that you need time to figure out or calculate. Questions like that were often quite entertaining in the past.

[owenziligation]

Well, we've just got to look on the bright side; So far, we've been seeing more $250,000 winners this season than in any other season, except for the first one, so I think maybe the clock could be a contributor to how well contestants are doing this season. Also, remember last season when people were bailing out before reaching $25K or llamaing out all over the place? By this point in the season last season, we saw 5 llamas and so far this season, we've only seen two so that's good.

My point is to look at the positives about the clock and the new format overall (Less early bail outs, less llamas, more big winners, etc.) and to not blame every little thing that happens on the clock.

[Millionaire Fan]

Don't forget using your lifelines stops the clock. If you ever go to a taping it takes about a minute or two for the ATA and PAF lifelines to kick in. By doing that it gives the contestants a little more time to read the question over and decide what they want to do. The clock go the best of my father and he needed to stop the clock on his $2,000 question.

[frogman042]

A couple of points (most of this I've mentioned in other threads and my recap of my experience on the show).

Although they did say that they would prefer if you didn't interrupt Meredith while she was reading the question I initially thought I would interrupt her. From the vantage point of being in the audience I was certain I would answer as soon as I knew I knew it whether or not Meredith was finished. I wanted to bank as much time for the million dollar question. I also planned to use a lifeline as soon as I could if the answer wasn't obvious, again to bank the time.

IMO, both these are bad strategies. In the seat, I never felt I was waiting for Meredith to finish, I wanted to make sure even on the easy ones that I didn't screw up, so while Meredith was reading the choices, I was reading ahead and double checking my answer so that when she was done, I was ready to answer with confidence. At home or in the audience it is easy to sit there and see the answer and wonder why they don't interrupt - in the seat it is different, you really do want the 'quiet' of no one talking to give your answer because the few seconds you save is not worth it for a stupid mistake that kicks you off too early.

When I did what I felt was my biggest mistake, using the ATA on the baby names question, I think I was influenced by what I had seen earlier of people missing their 'perfect category' and the desire not to waste seconds, instead of using the remaining time to think it through. I don't blame the clock, in fact, I don't blame anyone - it was a learning experience and I think I picked a poor approach. I think that there is enough remaining time left from the questions that you do know that you should never rush a decision to save 10-20 seconds on any specific questions and make a hasty decission - those few seconds wont help on the $1 million question if you don't get there and the 20-30 seconds you may gain will probably not be the deal breaker on the question, if you do get there, since you will almost certainly will have at least 2 or 3 minutes (conservately you should have banked 25 seconds for the lower tier, 90 seconds for the middle and upper tier assuming a mere 10 seconds left for each of those questions) plus the 45 seconds you get for the last question, you already have over 2 1/2 minutes - and in reality it would be higher - so an exter 10 or 20 seconds I don't feel would be that significant.

I think it is an error trying to maximize your banked time - an error I made - I'm not sure my outcome would have been much different, it would have depended on what the breakout of the Californication question would have been on the ATA - and that is something I will never know.

The key, I feel, is to pretend the clock doesn't exist - I know that wont work in all cases but I think that in the majority of cases it is the best approach.

---Jay

[gsabc]

A couple of points (most of this I've mentioned in other threads and my recap of my experience on the show).

Although they did say that they would prefer if you didn't interrupt Meredith while she was reading the question I initially thought I would interrupt her. From the vantage point of being in the audience I was certain I would answer as soon as I knew I knew it whether or not Meredith was finished. I wanted to bank as much time for the million dollar question. I also planned to use a lifeline as soon as I could if the answer wasn't obvious, again to bank the time.

IMO, both these are bad strategies. In the seat, I never felt I was waiting for Meredith to finish, I wanted to make sure even on the easy ones that I didn't screw up, so while Meredith was reading the choices, I was reading ahead and double checking my answer so that when she was done, I was ready to answer with confidence. At home or in the audience it is easy to sit there and see the answer and wonder why they don't interrupt - in the seat it is different, you really do want the 'quiet' of no one talking to give your answer because the few seconds you save is not worth it for a stupid mistake that kicks you off too early.

When I did what I felt was my biggest mistake, using the ATA on the baby names question, I think I was influenced by what I had seen earlier of people missing their 'perfect category' and the desire not to waste seconds, instead of using the remaining time to think it through. I don't blame the clock, in fact, I don't blame anyone - it was a learning experience and I think I picked a poor approach. I think that there is enough remaining time left from the questions that you do know that you should never rush a decision to save 10-20 seconds on any specific questions and make a hasty decission - those few seconds wont help on the $1 million question if you don't get there and the 20-30 seconds you may gain will probably not be the deal breaker on the question, if you do get there, since you will almost certainly will have at least 2 or 3 minutes (conservately you should have banked 25 seconds for the lower tier, 90 seconds for the middle and upper tier assuming a mere 10 seconds left for each of those questions) plus the 45 seconds you get for the last question, you already have over 2 1/2 minutes - and in reality it would be higher - so an exter 10 or 20 seconds I don't feel would be that significant.

I think it is an error trying to maximize your banked time - an error I made - I'm not sure my outcome would have been much different, it would have depended on what the breakout of the Californication question would have been on the ATA - and that is something I will never know.

The key, I feel, is to pretend the clock doesn't exist - I know that wont work in all cases but I think that in the majority of cases it is the best approach.

---Jay

Well put, Jay. I hadn't analyzed it to this level, but kind of felt this was the case. I truly wish Play It! was still around, because that's the closest thing to real practice you could try. In my one shot at it, there was one question where the time almost caught up with me without realizing it. A prompt from the host got me out of my reverie and I made my choice with just a few seconds left. I shall remember the advice when I get there for real. Assuming I'm not running up the winning games on J! by then. (is there a "yeah, right!" emoticon?)

[Bob Juch]

Well, we've just got to look on the bright side; So far, we've been seeing more $250,000 winners this season than in any other season, except for the first one, so I think maybe the clock could be a contributor to how well contestants are doing this season. Also, remember last season when people were bailing out before reaching $25K or llamaing out all over the place? By this point in the season last season, we saw 5 llamas and so far this season, we've only seen two so that's good.

My point is to look at the positives about the clock and the new format overall (Less early bail outs, less llamas, more big winners, etc.) and to not blame every little thing that happens on the clock.

There have been a lot of llamas who have not been broadcast.

[KillerTomato]

Well put, Jay. I hadn't analyzed it to this level, but kind of felt this was the case. I truly wish Play It! was still around, because that's the closest thing to real practice you could try. In my one shot at it, there was one question where the time almost caught up with me without realizing it. A prompt from the host got me out of my reverie and I made my choice with just a few seconds left. I shall remember the advice when I get there for real. Assuming I'm not running up the winning games on J! by then. (is there a "yeah, right!" emoticon?)

Right now, the best simulator really is the iPhone/iPod Touch version on iTunes. All the same lifelines, TDC....you don't have to wait to hear Meredith reading the answers, but other than that, it's very well done. A little easier than the real show (I get to the million waaaaaay more than I would on the show), but still... And admittedly, the PAF is a joke and doesn't simulate anything but a kind of second ATA. But it's a very good tool to practice with.

What it's taught me is that you CAN take your time through the first 5 questions, because it's easier for me to bank time on the SECOND and early THIRD tiers than on the first 5. Generally, when I have gotten to the $1MM question, I usually have between 3 and 4 minutes banked, and the majority of that comes from those sections, not the first 5, when you'd want to interrupt.

[TheConfessor]

There have been a lot of llamas who have not been broadcast.

They showed another llama today. I thought not showing llamas was a rare exception that has happened only once or twice. I'm not sure how any of us would know.

[gsabc]

Well put, Jay. I hadn't analyzed it to this level, but kind of felt this was the case. I truly wish Play It! was still around, because that's the closest thing to real practice you could try. In my one shot at it, there was one question where the time almost caught up with me without realizing it. A prompt from the host got me out of my reverie and I made my choice with just a few seconds left. I shall remember the advice when I get there for real. Assuming I'm not running up the winning games on J! by then. (is there a "yeah, right!" emoticon?)

Right now, the best simulator really is the iPhone/iPod Touch version on iTunes. All the same lifelines, TDC....you don't have to wait to hear Meredith reading the answers, but other than that, it's very well done. A little easier than the real show (I get to the million waaaaaay more than I would on the show), but still... And admittedly, the PAF is a joke and doesn't simulate anything but a kind of second ATA. But it's a very good tool to practice with.

What it's taught me is that you CAN take your time through the first 5 questions, because it's easier for me to bank time on the SECOND and early THIRD tiers than on the first 5. Generally, when I have gotten to the $1MM question, I usually have between 3 and 4 minutes banked, and the majority of that comes from those sections, not the first 5, when you'd want to interrupt.

Sounds good. I'll need to borrow GW's iPod Touch, though. Maybe I'll ask for my own for Father's Day. I need a new PDA.