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At least find out if the guy you're cutting in front of is an off-duty cop, before you pick a fight with him.

"I'm gonna kick your posterior!"

I guess them's fightin' words in Indiana.

Thousandaire wrote:"I'm gonna kick your posterior!"

I guess them's fightin' words in Indiana.

Me thinks that the quote was 'cleaned-up' for the paper, but I'm hoping I'm wrong and he really did say posterior.

It reminds me of an old Woody Allen routine from his stand-up days. He was cast as God in Gideon (Type-casting he called it) and was into method acting so he tried taking on the role in everyday life. He then was involved in a fender-bender and got out of his car and said unto the other dirver - "Be Fruitful and Multiply" but not in those words.

---Jay

So, the off-duty cop did not left them just leave Wal-Mart because . . . .

Is crime so under control in that part of Indiana that perceived line-cutting and macho-posturing is a serious offense?

Appa23 wrote:So, the off-duty cop did not left them just leave Wal-Mart because . . . .

Is crime so under control in that part of Indiana that line-cutting and macho-posturing is a serious offense?

Boys and their testosterone.

It's even worse when one of them has a badge.

Appa23 wrote:So, the off-duty cop did not left them just leave Wal-Mart because . . . .

Is crime so under control in that part of Indiana that line-cutting and macho-posturing is a serious offense?

Whether or not crime is otherwise under control I am deighted that they had their sorry butts put in jail.

This reminds me of the time SwampyTurtles was in line at a fast food restaurant. Let's say it was Burger King. She was not in uniform and was actually off-duty. The guy in line in front of her was carrying a not too well concealed weopon.

She tells a pretty good story, but the end result was a guy in custody that was suspected of robbing fast food places.

I wonder if she got a free lunch?

peacock2121 wrote:

Appa23 wrote:So, the off-duty cop did not left them just leave Wal-Mart because . . . .

Is crime so under control in that part of Indiana that line-cutting and macho-posturing is a serious offense?

Boys and their testosterone.

It's even worse when one of them has a badge.

I first read this as, "when one of hem has a bulge."

Appa23 wrote:So, the off-duty cop did not left them just leave Wal-Mart because . . . .

Is crime so under control in that part of Indiana that line-cutting and macho-posturing is a serious offense?

When someone threatens to use a gun, yes.

It's easy to see why everyone is assuming the father and son were in the wrong after reading the newspaper story. Let's play two games. First, let's pretend the younger Pluhar had been in line earlier, didn't have the documentation (or something else) he needed, and the customer service representative told him when he came back, to just come to the front of the line with whatever it was he forgot. Let's further pretend that perhaps the off duty policemen was not overly polite with his request to return to the back of the line. I know, policemen are always polite, but let's just pretend. The son ignores him, since he knows he's doing what he was told to do, but the dad, as dads are wont to do, took offense at the person's tone, and asks if he would like to take it outside. There was a day when that was actually considered polite, to offer to take a misunderstanding between two men outside, and being 62, this man was probably part of that generation. Further jawing ensues. We don't know what the off-duty policeman says, but since he was apparently laying a trap for Dad anyway, he probably didn't say anything actionable. When he does identify himself as a policeman and call for on-duty help, the two men attempt to leave. Notice that the two men are not placed under arrest by the off duty cop, which they certainly could be. Instead, he stands behind their van, so that if they try to leave, they've got additional charges. Is this a plausible story?

Second game: Let's pretend I'm the person in line, cold, tired, and exhausted. These two men come in and apparently try to cut in line. I tell them to get back to the end of the line. They behave exactly as described in the article, threatening to kick my ass and "subtly hinting" (the man looks positively like a master of subtlety, doesn't he?) that he has a gun. I then call the cops. I explain the situation truthfully. The cops search the two men, and find no gun. Do they haul them off to jail?

It probably doesn't help that I've spent time in Muncie, and my experience has been that the newspaper story could be exactly right in describing the two rude ones, or it could be horribly, horribly slanted against them. And it's almost certain that they didn't include all the things the cop did and said.

If I was in Muncie, and I was an attorney, I'd be offering to represent the Pluhars on a case of unlawful imprisonment against the policeman. Which explains why I'm not an attorney. I'm normally a law-and-order guy, but it drives me nuts when the cops abuse their authority.

Men, waiting in a line, testosterone, a badge.

Recipe for bad things.

mrkelley23 wrote:It's easy to see why everyone is assuming the father and son were in the wrong after reading the newspaper story. Let's play two games. First, let's pretend the younger Pluhar had been in line earlier, didn't have the documentation (or something else) he needed, and the customer service representative told him when he came back, to just come to the front of the line with whatever it was he forgot. Let's further pretend that perhaps the off duty policemen was not overly polite with his request to return to the back of the line. I know, policemen are always polite, but let's just pretend. The son ignores him, since he knows he's doing what he was told to do, but the dad, as dads are wont to do, took offense at the person's tone, and asks if he would like to take it outside. There was a day when that was actually considered polite, to offer to take a misunderstanding between two men outside, and being 62, this man was probably part of that generation. Further jawing ensues. We don't know what the off-duty policeman says, but since he was apparently laying a trap for Dad anyway, he probably didn't say anything actionable. When he does identify himself as a policeman and call for on-duty help, the two men attempt to leave. Notice that the two men are not placed under arrest by the off duty cop, which they certainly could be. Instead, he stands behind their van, so that if they try to leave, they've got additional charges. Is this a plausible story?

Second game: Let's pretend I'm the person in line, cold, tired, and exhausted. These two men come in and apparently try to cut in line. I tell them to get back to the end of the line. They behave exactly as described in the article, threatening to kick my ass and "subtly hinting" (the man looks positively like a master of subtlety, doesn't he?) that he has a gun. I then call the cops. I explain the situation truthfully. The cops search the two men, and find no gun. Do they haul them off to jail?

It probably doesn't help that I've spent time in Muncie, and my experience has been that the newspaper story could be exactly right in describing the two rude ones, or it could be horribly, horribly slanted against them. And it's almost certain that they didn't include all the things the cop did and said.

If I was in Muncie, and I was an attorney, I'd be offering to represent the Pluhars on a case of unlawful imprisonment against the policeman. Which explains why I'm not an attorney. I'm normally a law-and-order guy, but it drives me nuts when the cops abuse their authority.

Your write-up shows why you would make a pretty darn good lawyer, MrK.

As I read the story, my first thought was "if I still was a criminal defense attorney, I could get the charges dropped easy on these facts."

mrkelley23 wrote: It probably doesn't help that I've spent time in Muncie, and my experience has been that the newspaper story could be exactly right in describing the two rude ones, or it could be horribly, horribly slanted against them. And it's almost certain that they didn't include all the things the cop did and said.

Somehow I feel like I should spring to the defense of Muncie but I'm not going to do that.

And here is the AP story which has the line cutter's side of the incident:

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/art ... QD95MHURG0

andrewjackson wrote: And here is the AP story which has the line cutter's side of the incident:

Looks like mrkelley did a great job calling that one!

There is a certain small percentage of the population, usually people who are somewhat large in size, that has learned that they can bully and intimidate others and usually get away with it. This includes tactics such as cutting in line whenever they feel like it.

There is another small percentage of the population, which to a certain extent overlaps the first, that has learned that they can make virtually any ridiculous request they want in a store, threaten to make a stink about it, and then get their way, because the low level employees they are dealing with will very often cave in on the theory that the "customer is always right," and on those occasions on which the manager is summoned, they can usually gruff talk their way through things too as long as it's not a completely insane demand.

When I've been in a line at a store and, for whatever reason, someone is waved to the head of the line, the clerk usually acknowledges in some way that this was done with his approval. In this case, what probably happened was two large bullies got caught trying out their tactics on the one person who wouldn't be intimidated. If the store was that crowded, there would be no shortage of witnesses to what happened, in case those two jerks decide to make a case out of it.

mrkelley23 wrote: We don't know what the off-duty policeman says, but since he was apparently laying a trap for Dad anyway, he probably didn't say anything actionable. When he does identify himself as a policeman and call for on-duty help, the two men attempt to leave.

Let's say the cop is having a drink in a bar when a guy comes up to him and asks him if he'd like to get high. Does the cop say, I'm sorry, I'm a police officer and you should know that drugs are illegal so I can't talk to you any further? Or does he play along seeing where this will lead?

Or let's suppose the cop is at a gun show and someone says he knows how to get his hands on some really powerful guns without going through any red tape? Does the cop play along?

Police are trained to be observant 24 hours a day and what to do when they see suspicious behavior. This often involves seeing just where a potentially illegal, but not immediately actionable, situation will lead.

You can't fix stupid.


t.

tlynn78 wrote:You can't fix stupid.


t.

Well, you can, but I'd prefer it be done before the genetic problem is passed on.

tlynn78 wrote:You can't fix stupid.


t.

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