I think her writers set her up

The forum for general posting. Come join the madness. :)
Message
Author
User avatar
Bob78164
Bored Moderator
Posts: 22159
Joined: Mon Oct 08, 2007 12:02 pm
Location: By the phone

Re: I think her writers set her up

#51 Post by Bob78164 » Wed Jul 20, 2016 3:55 pm

silvercamaro wrote:My reaction is, to the exent that Melania may have borrowed words or thoughts, that she took them from my mother and probably your mother, everybody's grandfather, countless commencement speakers, and an array of would-be small town mayors, among others. In other words, there is an unofficial and probably unpublished list of "Good Things To Say." Many public speakers snag phrases from the list as it floats around the ether. That may mean the speakers are not particularly original in every respect, but they've still said good things. This does not rise to the level of plagiarism, any more than if I advise a prospective sun-bather to "Wear sunscreen," even though that has been said before.
That's kind of hard to square with the speechwriter's belated admission that she did, in fact, use words lifted directly from Michelle Obama's speech. What's worse for that position, the speechwriter says that she got those words from Melania Trump herself, which means that Ms. Trump knew their source.

Do I correctly recall that you have a background in journalism? If a newspaper writer lifted that much language from another source without attribution, wouldn't she be fired?

The criticism of the plagiarism is (in my view) entirely fair, and with this new revelation it's likewise fair to lay at least some of the blame directly on Melania Trump. --Bob
"Question with boldness even the existence of a God; because, if there be one, he must more approve of the homage of reason than that of blindfolded fear." Thomas Jefferson

User avatar
Estonut
Evil Genius
Posts: 10495
Joined: Sat Oct 13, 2007 1:16 am
Location: Garden Grove, CA

Re: I think her writers set her up

#52 Post by Estonut » Wed Jul 20, 2016 5:11 pm

Bob78164 wrote:The incident also gives a window into the candidate's crisis-management skills. This goes away immediately if they'd just said, "oops." Instead, the campaign dug in, and just kept digging.
Wait! Which candidate are you referring to?
A child of five would understand this. Send someone to fetch a child of five.
Groucho Marx

User avatar
Estonut
Evil Genius
Posts: 10495
Joined: Sat Oct 13, 2007 1:16 am
Location: Garden Grove, CA

Re: I think her writers set her up

#53 Post by Estonut » Wed Jul 20, 2016 8:44 pm

Bob78164 wrote:The plagiarism itself isn't the issue. But it speaks volumes about the campaign's competence, and through it, the candidate's.
I guess it didn't matter in the past...

A child of five would understand this. Send someone to fetch a child of five.
Groucho Marx

User avatar
tlynn78
Posts: 9616
Joined: Tue Oct 09, 2007 9:31 am
Location: Montana

Re: I think her writers set her up

#54 Post by tlynn78 » Wed Jul 20, 2016 8:52 pm

Estonut wrote:
Bob78164 wrote:The incident also gives a window into the candidate's crisis-management skills. This goes away immediately if they'd just said, "oops." Instead, the campaign dug in, and just kept digging.
Wait! Which candidate are you referring to?

LOL - my thought, exactly!
When reality requires approval, control replaces truth.
To argue with a person who has renounced the use of reason is like administering medicine to the dead. -Thomas Paine
You can ignore reality, but you can't ignore the consequences of ignoring reality. -Ayn Rand
Those who can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities. -Voltaire

User avatar
silverscreenselect
Posts: 24669
Joined: Mon Oct 08, 2007 11:21 pm
Contact:

Re: I think her writers set her up

#55 Post by silverscreenselect » Wed Jul 20, 2016 9:50 pm

tlynn78 wrote:
BackInTex wrote:
silverscreenselect wrote: The Republican convention is turning into a trainwreck
That's the narrative the media is trying to spin.

I've actually spoken to several people attending the convention - they are, to a person, astounded at how different their actual experiences are compared to what they're seeing on the 'news.' Shocker.
Someone please remind me again about how smoothly the Republican convention is going.
Check out our website: http://www.silverscreenvideos.com

User avatar
Bob Juch
Posts: 27132
Joined: Mon Oct 08, 2007 11:58 am
Location: Oro Valley, Arizona
Contact:

Re: I think her writers set her up

#56 Post by Bob Juch » Thu Jul 21, 2016 12:00 am

Apparently using Ms. McIver is against campaign finance laws.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the ... echwriter/
I may not have gone where I intended to go, but I think I have ended up where I needed to be.
- Douglas Adams (1952 - 2001)

Si fractum non sit, noli id reficere.

Teach a child to be polite and courteous in the home and, when he grows up, he'll never be able to drive in New Jersey.

User avatar
BackInTex
Posts: 13737
Joined: Mon Oct 08, 2007 12:43 pm
Location: In Texas of course!

Re: I think her writers set her up

#57 Post by BackInTex » Thu Jul 21, 2016 6:53 am

Bob Juch wrote:Apparently using Ms. McIver is against campaign finance laws.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the ... echwriter/
The didn't intend to break any laws, so its perfectly O.K.
..what country can preserve it’s liberties if their rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance? let them take arms.
~~ Thomas Jefferson

War is where the government tells you who the bad guy is.
Revolution is when you decide that for yourself.
-- Benjamin Franklin (maybe)

User avatar
Bob Juch
Posts: 27132
Joined: Mon Oct 08, 2007 11:58 am
Location: Oro Valley, Arizona
Contact:

Re: I think her writers set her up

#58 Post by Bob Juch » Thu Jul 21, 2016 7:17 am

BackInTex wrote:
Bob Juch wrote:Apparently using Ms. McIver is against campaign finance laws.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the ... echwriter/
The didn't intend to break any laws, so it's perfectly O.K.
I'll try that excuse if I ever get arrested.
I may not have gone where I intended to go, but I think I have ended up where I needed to be.
- Douglas Adams (1952 - 2001)

Si fractum non sit, noli id reficere.

Teach a child to be polite and courteous in the home and, when he grows up, he'll never be able to drive in New Jersey.

User avatar
earendel
Posts: 13904
Joined: Tue Oct 09, 2007 5:25 am
Location: mired in the bureaucracy

Re: I think her writers set her up

#59 Post by earendel » Thu Jul 21, 2016 8:03 am

Estonut wrote:
Bob78164 wrote:The plagiarism itself isn't the issue. But it speaks volumes about the campaign's competence, and through it, the candidate's.
I guess it didn't matter in the past...

Not exactly.
http://www.snopes.com/2016/07/20/barack ... l-patrick/
"Elen sila lumenn omentielvo...A star shines on the hour of our meeting."

User avatar
Bob Juch
Posts: 27132
Joined: Mon Oct 08, 2007 11:58 am
Location: Oro Valley, Arizona
Contact:

Re: I think her writers set her up

#60 Post by Bob Juch » Thu Jul 21, 2016 8:14 am

Apparently, Meredith McIver is not a real person!

http://bipartisanreport.com/2016/07/20/ ... ke-person/
I may not have gone where I intended to go, but I think I have ended up where I needed to be.
- Douglas Adams (1952 - 2001)

Si fractum non sit, noli id reficere.

Teach a child to be polite and courteous in the home and, when he grows up, he'll never be able to drive in New Jersey.

User avatar
BackInTex
Posts: 13737
Joined: Mon Oct 08, 2007 12:43 pm
Location: In Texas of course!

Re: I think her writers set her up

#61 Post by BackInTex » Thu Jul 21, 2016 8:52 am

Bob Juch wrote:
BackInTex wrote:
Bob Juch wrote:Apparently using Ms. McIver is against campaign finance laws.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the ... echwriter/
The didn't intend to break any laws, so it's perfectly O.K.
I'll try that excuse if I ever get arrested.
Might as well. Worked for Hillary.
..what country can preserve it’s liberties if their rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance? let them take arms.
~~ Thomas Jefferson

War is where the government tells you who the bad guy is.
Revolution is when you decide that for yourself.
-- Benjamin Franklin (maybe)

User avatar
littlebeast13
Dumbass
Posts: 31591
Joined: Mon Oct 08, 2007 7:20 pm
Location: Between the Sterilite and the Farberware
Contact:

Re: I think her writers set her up

#62 Post by littlebeast13 » Thu Jul 21, 2016 9:07 am

Anyone else think it's ironic that the latest political thread to blow up was started by the Moratorium Lounge's biggest proponent?

lb13

User avatar
BackInTex
Posts: 13737
Joined: Mon Oct 08, 2007 12:43 pm
Location: In Texas of course!

Re: I think her writers set her up

#63 Post by BackInTex » Thu Jul 21, 2016 9:14 am

Bob Juch wrote:Apparently, Meredith McIver is not a real person!

http://bipartisanreport.com/2016/07/20/ ... ke-person/
And she's only got the one polka dot jacket.

Image


Image
..what country can preserve it’s liberties if their rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance? let them take arms.
~~ Thomas Jefferson

War is where the government tells you who the bad guy is.
Revolution is when you decide that for yourself.
-- Benjamin Franklin (maybe)

User avatar
silverscreenselect
Posts: 24669
Joined: Mon Oct 08, 2007 11:21 pm
Contact:

Re: I think her writers set her up

#64 Post by silverscreenselect » Thu Jul 21, 2016 9:41 am

I was actually worried when the convention started that some foaming-at-the-mouth lynch mob mentality idiots outside the convention might go overboard like Chicago 1968 and give the Republicans some more law and order ammunition, but I haven't heard a bit of coverage about them. Instead, all the foaming-at-the-mouth lynch mob mentality idiots have been inside the convention wanting to go after immigrants, Hillary Clinton, and Ted Cruz and his wife.
Check out our website: http://www.silverscreenvideos.com

User avatar
mellytu74
Posts: 9694
Joined: Mon Oct 08, 2007 7:02 pm
Location: Philadelphia, PA

Re: I think her writers set her up

#65 Post by mellytu74 » Thu Jul 21, 2016 9:55 am

The Barack Obama Deval Patrick thing is a LOT like the Donald Trump, Jr. - Frank Buckley thing from Trump's speech.

Both speakers used language that the originator SAID they could use (Patrick from speeches, Buckley - who helped Trump write the speech - from a column).

Someone hung Melania Trump out to dry and it's not pretty and certainly not fair.

What is FAR more disturbing to me is what is now the SECOND indication that Donald Trump has no intention of governing. He doesn't rule out quitting after he wins (if he wins) and, if the Kasich story is to be believed (and I do), the offer of being the most powerful VP in history because Trump will designate all foreign and dmoestic issues to the VP so he can go about the business of making American Great Again.

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/07/08/us/po ... .html?_r=0

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/07/20/magaz ... -mate.html

Now, one of the things that bothers me so much about this .... many of the people who are voting for Donald Trump are doing do because of his opposition to free trade and his desire to rework the trade agreements, get rid of NAFTA, etc. They are supporting him because of the Muslim ban (even though Trump himself has backed off on that).

Pense is an ardent free trader who opposed the Muslim ban.

While those votes would certainly be votes against Hillary, no matter what, the people I know who are voting for Trump are not people who particularly like being played (which is one of the reasons they ARE voting for Trump - see above). To find out that his doesn't particularly care about following through on all the stuff he campaigned on will piss them off royally (these people are relatives - I know their reactions to things).

Yes, Pence will serve at the will of the president. That's how it works. But, did they discuss this?

AND, if Trump is banking on Bernie people crossing over to vote for him because of NAFTA, et al, THOSE votes go out the window if he's turning the reins over to Mike Pence, who adores Right to Work.

Plus, !@$%@#^#$&& this isn't a game, you arrogant SOB.

BTW, FWIW, I gotta go with the Ted Cruz corner last night. Why WOULD he endorse Trump after Trump accused his father of helping to kill JFK?

It's Trump's OWN fault for giving him a platform after being told repeatedly - including in a phone call several days ago and a face-to-face meeting several weeks ago. A concession to the folks who didn't vote for Trump and whose votes were squashed in the floor fight? Fine - put him on at 4 p.m. on the first day, then. Not a prime-time slot.

User avatar
Estonut
Evil Genius
Posts: 10495
Joined: Sat Oct 13, 2007 1:16 am
Location: Garden Grove, CA

Re: I think her writers set her up

#66 Post by Estonut » Fri Jul 22, 2016 3:12 am

Bob Juch wrote:
Estonut wrote:
Bob Juch wrote:To use your favorite type of excuse: Condoleezza Rice, Colin Powell, and Madeleine Albright all had private servers and have admitted to transmitting known classified material on them.
I am shocked that a computer expert like you doesn't know the difference between private e-mail and a private server!! :shock:
Of course I do. What makes you think I don't?
I was giving you the benefit of the doubt by assuming you didn't know. Since you do know the difference, you are just spreading lies. What a surprise!

Hillary Clinton Said 'My Predecessors Did the Same Thing' with Email
We rate this claim Mostly False.
A child of five would understand this. Send someone to fetch a child of five.
Groucho Marx

User avatar
Jeemie
Posts: 7303
Joined: Tue Oct 09, 2007 5:35 pm
Location: City of Champions Once More (Well, in spirit)!!!!

Re: I think her writers set her up

#67 Post by Jeemie » Fri Jul 22, 2016 9:40 am

Pastor Fireball wrote:I find it hilariously ironic how 99% of Republicans have spent the past decade slandering President Obama and his family, yet they're all too comfortable with passing off an Obama idea as their own.

If anything, I do have to give some credit to tangerine-tinted trash can fire Donald Trump. He was actually right about one thing all along. Last night, we had actual proof of an immigrant stealing something from a hard-working American.
That wasn't an "Obama" idea...it was a Trump speechwriter cribbing from an Obama speechwriter.

We should ask ourselves why we're incensed about this "plagiarism" but not the fact that our leaders, almost every day, go before us and speak words to us that are not their own.

For me, this was a non-issue.

The bigger story this week was one I simply cannot believe is not getting more play...and that's the story that Donald Trump was offering to outsource his job to whoever would be his Vice-president. While he was busy "making America great again".

So for the first time in our history, we have a major party candidate who is essentially admitting he doesn't want to actually DO the job he's running for.

And it got hardly any play whatsoever.
1979 City of Champions 2009

User avatar
Jeemie
Posts: 7303
Joined: Tue Oct 09, 2007 5:35 pm
Location: City of Champions Once More (Well, in spirit)!!!!

Re: I think her writers set her up

#68 Post by Jeemie » Fri Jul 22, 2016 9:43 am

I see Melly beat me to it.

The other story was the NYT interview, where Trump's NATO comments got a lot of fire, again for me, what was worse was the rest of interview, where Trump shows off three characteristics that would be terrible in any government official, let alone the President of the United States.

*He doesn't understand the issues in even their most basic form
*Even worse, he shows no desire to LEARN about the issues- he's had several chances at some of them, and I'm sure he's got experts to help him devise better answers, and he STILL hasn't done it
*Worst of all, he's someone who doesn't even want to admit there are things he doesn't know (and nobody can know everything, so there's no shame in admitting you don't know something).

He makes George W. Bush look like a great intellectual scholar, for comparison's sake.
1979 City of Champions 2009

User avatar
silverscreenselect
Posts: 24669
Joined: Mon Oct 08, 2007 11:21 pm
Contact:

Re: I think her writers set her up

#69 Post by silverscreenselect » Fri Jul 22, 2016 10:24 am

Jeemie wrote:I see Melly beat me to it.

The other story was the NYT interview, where Trump's NATO comments got a lot of fire, again for me, what was worse was the rest of interview, where Trump shows off three characteristics that would be terrible in any government official, let alone the President of the United States.

*He doesn't understand the issues in even their most basic form
*Even worse, he shows no desire to LEARN about the issues- he's had several chances at some of them, and I'm sure he's got experts to help him devise better answers, and he STILL hasn't done it
*Worst of all, he's someone who doesn't even want to admit there are things he doesn't know (and nobody can know everything, so there's no shame in admitting you don't know something).

He makes George W. Bush look like a great intellectual scholar, for comparison's sake.
Uninformed people who think Trump is a business genius aren't aware that he got his money the old fashioned way, he inherited it from his father. The only thing he's shown a flair for is self-promotion shilling reality TV shows, pro wrestling, and home shopping network steaks.
Check out our website: http://www.silverscreenvideos.com

User avatar
Bob Juch
Posts: 27132
Joined: Mon Oct 08, 2007 11:58 am
Location: Oro Valley, Arizona
Contact:

Re: I think her writers set her up

#70 Post by Bob Juch » Fri Jul 22, 2016 11:38 am

silverscreenselect wrote:
Jeemie wrote:I see Melly beat me to it.

The other story was the NYT interview, where Trump's NATO comments got a lot of fire, again for me, what was worse was the rest of interview, where Trump shows off three characteristics that would be terrible in any government official, let alone the President of the United States.

*He doesn't understand the issues in even their most basic form
*Even worse, he shows no desire to LEARN about the issues- he's had several chances at some of them, and I'm sure he's got experts to help him devise better answers, and he STILL hasn't done it
*Worst of all, he's someone who doesn't even want to admit there are things he doesn't know (and nobody can know everything, so there's no shame in admitting you don't know something).

He makes George W. Bush look like a great intellectual scholar, for comparison's sake.
Uninformed people who think Trump is a business genius aren't aware that he got his money the old fashioned way, he inherited it from his father. The only thing he's shown a flair for is self-promotion shilling reality TV shows, pro wrestling, and home shopping network steaks.
And his self-claimed net worth is LESS than it would be if he had simply invested his inheritance.
I may not have gone where I intended to go, but I think I have ended up where I needed to be.
- Douglas Adams (1952 - 2001)

Si fractum non sit, noli id reficere.

Teach a child to be polite and courteous in the home and, when he grows up, he'll never be able to drive in New Jersey.

User avatar
tlynn78
Posts: 9616
Joined: Tue Oct 09, 2007 9:31 am
Location: Montana

Re: I think her writers set her up

#71 Post by tlynn78 » Mon Jul 25, 2016 9:57 am

silverscreenselect wrote:
tlynn78 wrote:
BackInTex wrote:
That's the narrative the media is trying to spin.

I've actually spoken to several people attending the convention - they are, to a person, astounded at how different their actual experiences are compared to what they're seeing on the 'news.' Shocker.
Someone please remind me again about how smoothly the Republican convention is going.

Now I've been able to speak to five individuals who actually attended in person, and their stories are very consistent. After they saw news coverage, they each, to a person, said they must have been attending a different convention, or words to that effect. Their individual takes were that security was incredible, that there were a 'handful' of protestors, that there were approximately 15,000 members of the press compared to approximately 2000 delegates (suppose there might have been some pressure to dig up "stories"?) and, at least for the nineteen year-old, a remarkable learning experience.
Now, let's see how the Dems do!
When reality requires approval, control replaces truth.
To argue with a person who has renounced the use of reason is like administering medicine to the dead. -Thomas Paine
You can ignore reality, but you can't ignore the consequences of ignoring reality. -Ayn Rand
Those who can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities. -Voltaire

User avatar
Jeemie
Posts: 7303
Joined: Tue Oct 09, 2007 5:35 pm
Location: City of Champions Once More (Well, in spirit)!!!!

Re: I think her writers set her up

#72 Post by Jeemie » Mon Jul 25, 2016 10:24 am

Bob Juch wrote:And his self-claimed net worth is LESS than it would be if he had simply invested his inheritance.
He actually has a boatload of debt- would go into office as the most highly indebted President we've ever had.

Another thing no one's talking about because one of the last remaining banks to give him lots of loans, Deutsche Bank, just happens to be a bank the current administration is butting heads with over their attempts to dodge the new rules that are supposed to protect against crises like the subprime crisis from happening again.

And while I actually am closer to his position on NATO and Russia than I am the neoliberals (or neo-cons- whatever the hell they're called nowadays) that constantly pump up Russia as an existential threat to the West rather than the great power rival that they are, Putin is no saint...and Trump has gotten a LOT of money from Russian oligarchs.

Which may (or may not) have something to do with the fact that there was only ONE part of the GOP platform that Trump used his influence on- and that was on a plank that softened the GOP's hardline stance towards Russia. And it may (or may not) explain his comments as to how he "wouldn't necessarily come to the Baltics' defense" were they to be attacked by Russia.

Which just goes to show the terrible terrible choice that we have this November because a third party candidate has no chance.
1979 City of Champions 2009

User avatar
Vandal
Director of Promos
Posts: 7507
Joined: Mon Oct 08, 2007 6:42 pm
Location: Literary Circles
Contact:

Re: I think her writers set her up

#73 Post by Vandal » Mon Jul 25, 2016 10:24 am

From twitter:
Jenny Johnson 
‏@JennyJohnsonHi5
The Republican and Democratic Conventions look like a mashup of 'American Gladiators' and C-SPAN.
_________________________________________________________________________________
Visit my website: http://www.rmclarkauthor.com

User avatar
silverscreenselect
Posts: 24669
Joined: Mon Oct 08, 2007 11:21 pm
Contact:

Re: I think her writers set her up

#74 Post by silverscreenselect » Tue Jul 26, 2016 4:23 am

Jeemie wrote: Putin is no saint...and Trump has gotten a LOT of money from Russian oligarchs.
Apparently, he's gotten a good bit of computer technical support from them too.
Check out our website: http://www.silverscreenvideos.com

User avatar
jarnon
Posts: 7002
Joined: Tue Oct 09, 2007 9:52 pm
Location: Merion, Pa.

Re: I think her writers set her up

#75 Post by jarnon » Tue Aug 02, 2016 5:40 pm

Bob78164 wrote:Here's a link to the letter from the speechwriter who's accepting the blame.
The Dems have their scapegoats too:

3 More Top DNC Officials Out After Wikileaks Email Release
Слава Україні!

Post Reply