PT-BAM Transcript: Ken Basin (Fresca) (8/23/09)

[ulysses5019]

Alaska and Hawaii were not states when Louise Brooks lived in Kansas.

My turn to get educated. Who's Louise Brooks? --Bob

I didn't know this either.

I looked it up.

Apparently she became the cult figure Fanny talked about because the French fell in love with her.

I always thought it was the cool hairdo. But I always liked Veronica Lake.

[frogman042]

So, I'm back and during my lunch break I went down to the LBJ Library. The buttons are not on the desk that they have set up in the oval office recreation. There is a remote control for the TVs that are built into a cabinet and a phone with a connecting box that had about a dozen buttons on it - none of which were for ordering drinks. I asked a number of people who worked there and spoke to the person who is in charge of photographing the exhibits - he said that the device was definitly not on the desk in their set-up. I asked if they have a photo of it and he said he didn't but he referred me to the curator - who was out, but I left him a voice mail asking if he had a photo or any info regarding the 4 buttons set up for drinks. Also, if you press the button for the audio that goes with the oval office room - it talks about a number of things but nothing about buttons for drinks or Fresca. I also looked at a lot of the photos they had up as well as glancing through a big coffee table book about LBJ in the White House filled with photos, and the few I could find that showed his desk didn't not seem to show any 4 button signaling device at all (some had the desk nearly bare for talks into the camara, but the ones with him working at his desk, showed a number of items but nothing that I could tell matches the device in the question).

As an interesting point, I asked the same million dollar question to 5 people who work at the Library - these are people surrounded by LBJ memorbilia, including two people who work the information desk and the person who works the gift shop. None of them knew it outright and only one of the 5 guessed Fresca, but it was just a guess on their part.

So, Ken, if the folks who work at the LBJ library where a replica of the oval office is located including his actual desk didn't know the answer.... well, that was a killer question and hopefully you want feel so bad in not getting it.

---Jay

[Estonut]

Well, I know that the geographic center of the coterminous United States is in Kansas, but determining the geographic center of all of North America is more of a challenge.

I do not think that word means what you think it means...

[MarleysGh0st]

So, I'm back and during my lunch break I went down to the LBJ Library. The buttons are not on the desk that they have set up in the oval office recreation. There is a remote control for the TVs that are built into a cabinet and a phone with a connecting box that had about a dozen buttons on it - none of which were for ordering drinks. I asked a number of people who worked there and spoke to the person who is in charge of photographing the exhibits - he said that the device was definitly not on the desk in their set-up. I asked if they have a photo of it and he said he didn't but he referred me to the curator - who was out, but I left him a voice mail asking if he had a photo or any info regarding the 4 buttons set up for drinks. Also, if you press the button for the audio that goes with the oval office room - it talks about a number of things but nothing about buttons for drinks or Fresca. I also looked at a lot of the photos they had up as well as glancing through a big coffee table book about LBJ in the White House filled with photos, and the few I could find that showed his desk didn't not seem to show any 4 button signaling device at all (some had the desk nearly bare for talks into the camara, but the ones with him working at his desk, showed a number of items but nothing that I could tell matches the device in the question).

As an interesting point, I asked the same million dollar question to 5 people who work at the Library - these are people surrounded by LBJ memorbilia, including two people who work the information desk and the person who works the gift shop. None of them knew it outright and only one of the 5 guessed Fresca, but it was just a guess on their part.

So, Ken, if the folks who work at the LBJ library where a replica of the oval office is located including his actual desk didn't know the answer.... well, that was a killer question and hopefully you want feel so bad in not getting it.

---Jay

Hmmmm.

So are there reliable references that say these buttons actually existed? Or is this another internet circular reference question like a venue of vultures?

[hanzz]

Well, I know that the geographic center of the coterminous United States is in Kansas, but determining the geographic center of all of North America is more of a challenge.

I do not think that word means what you think it means...

Wikipedia seems to be ok with it:

"While coterminous U.S. and conterminous U.S. have the same precise meaning as contiguous U.S., some other terms are commonly used to describe the 48 contiguous states, but each may have some degree of ambiguity."

[silvercamaro]

So, I'm back and during my lunch break I went down to the LBJ Library. The buttons are not on the desk that they have set up in the oval office recreation. There is a remote control for the TVs that are built into a cabinet and a phone with a connecting box that had about a dozen buttons on it - none of which were for ordering drinks. I asked a number of people who worked there and spoke to the person who is in charge of photographing the exhibits - he said that the device was definitly not on the desk in their set-up. I asked if they have a photo of it and he said he didn't but he referred me to the curator - who was out, but I left him a voice mail asking if he had a photo or any info regarding the 4 buttons set up for drinks. Also, if you press the button for the audio that goes with the oval office room - it talks about a number of things but nothing about buttons for drinks or Fresca. I also looked at a lot of the photos they had up as well as glancing through a big coffee table book about LBJ in the White House filled with photos, and the few I could find that showed his desk didn't not seem to show any 4 button signaling device at all (some had the desk nearly bare for talks into the camara, but the ones with him working at his desk, showed a number of items but nothing that I could tell matches the device in the question).

As an interesting point, I asked the same million dollar question to 5 people who work at the Library - these are people surrounded by LBJ memorbilia, including two people who work the information desk and the person who works the gift shop. None of them knew it outright and only one of the 5 guessed Fresca, but it was just a guess on their part.

So, Ken, if the folks who work at the LBJ library where a replica of the oval office is located including his actual desk didn't know the answer.... well, that was a killer question and hopefully you want feel so bad in not getting it.

---Jay

Very interesting. I have read many passages that said something to the effect of "LBJ liked Fresca so much that he had a Fresca fountain installed in the Oval Office." (I had accepted this as fact, but I don't KNOW it to be true.) At any rate, if he did have a fountain for Fresca, that would eliminate the need to have a button to order that particular drink to be brought in by staff members from outside the office.

It's too bad that BAM writers aren't required to footnote their answers, citing the source(s) of their information.

[MarleysGh0st]

Very interesting. I have read many passages that said something to the effect of "LBJ liked Fresca so much that he had a Fresca fountain installed in the Oval Office." (I had accepted this as fact, but I don't KNOW it to be true.) At any rate, if he did have a fountain for Fresca, that would eliminate the need to have a button to order that particular drink to be brought in by staff members from outside the office.

It's too bad that BAM writers aren't required to footnote their answers, citing the source(s) of their information.

A private fountain sounds cool, as does a special row of buttons for ordering drinks. But practically speaking, the President of the United States has quite a large staff, including people who can handle such requests. What's so inefficient about picking up a phone or pressing an intercom button and saying "Fresca"?

Or perhaps, "Tea, Earl Grey, hot."

[Rod Serling]

Very interesting. I have read many passages that said something to the effect of "LBJ liked Fresca so much that he had a Fresca fountain installed in the Oval Office." (I had accepted this as fact, but I don't KNOW it to be true.) At any rate, if he did have a fountain for Fresca, that would eliminate the need to have a button to order that particular drink to be brought in by staff members from outside the office.

It's too bad that BAM writers aren't required to footnote their answers, citing the source(s) of their information.

A private fountain sounds cool, as does a special row of buttons for ordering drinks. But practically speaking, the President of the United States has quite a large staff, including people who can handle such requests. What's so inefficient about picking up a phone or pressing an intercom button and saying "Fresca"?

Or perhaps, "Tea, Earl Grey, hot."

How about some hot chocolate in the English Bone China cup?

[Estonut]

Well, I know that the geographic center of the coterminous United States is in Kansas, but determining the geographic center of all of North America is more of a challenge.

I do not think that word means what you think it means...

Wikipedia seems to be ok with it:

"While coterminous U.S. and conterminous U.S. have the same precise meaning as contiguous U.S., some other terms are commonly used to describe the 48 contiguous states, but each may have some degree of ambiguity."

Merriam-Webster defines them without ambiguity...


coterminous
One entry found.

Main Entry: co·ter·mi·nous
Pronunciation: \(ˌ)kō-ˈtər-mə-nəs\
Function: adjective
Etymology: alteration of conterminous
Date: 1799
1 : having the same or coincident boundaries <a voting district coterminous with the city>
2 : coextensive in scope or duration <an experience of life coterminous with the years of his father — Elizabeth Hardwick>
— co·ter·mi·nous·ly adverb


conterminous
One entry found.

Main Entry: con·ter·mi·nous
Pronunciation: \kən-ˈtər-mə-nəs, kän-\
Function: adjective
Etymology: Latin conterminus, from com- + terminus boundary — more at term
Date: 1631
1 : having a common boundary <conterminous countries>
2 : coterminous
3 : enclosed within one common boundary <the 48 conterminous states>
— con·ter·mi·nous·ly adverb

[Bob78164]

Merriam-Webster defines them without ambiguity...

So let me get this straight. Are you suggesting that Wikipedia was wr . . . . wro . . . . not correct? --Bob

[Estonut]

Merriam-Webster defines them without ambiguity...

So let me get this straight. Are you suggesting that Wikipedia was wr . . . . wro . . . . not correct? --Bob

No. Just that M-W requires actual pre-publication research...

[thguy65]

This article about LBJ's recording system mentions a Fresca "switch" set up in the lounge area adjacent to the Oval Office. According to the footnote, it (now called a "button" in the footnote) would prompt the valet to send him the appropriate beverage. It doesn't necessarily mean that there wasn't one in the Oval Office as well, but perhaps people are equating the two locations.

I suppose "some lawyer" could do more research and possibly make a case that it's a badly-composed question with no true correct answer, but I'm sure that would risk looking truly schmuck-like. (If a challenge to the question is successful, I work on 10% commission. )

[ghostjmf]

silvercam says:

At any rate, if he did have a fountain for Fresca, that would eliminate the need to have a button to order that particular drink to be brought in by staff members from outside the office.

Or it could mean the button was on the fountain; you pushed it, Fresca came out, much as it does at various self-serve places these days. (Well, Fresca is rarely one of the choices, but you know what I mean.) You can tell I've been eating at too many rest area restaurants. But of course Estonut is so sure that's not what the question said/meant.

I had never read/heard about that private soda fountain to my knowledge, but it somehow sounds "more LBJ" than him having a signalling device for a valet to come in bearing a particular drink.

[Bob Juch]

silvercam says:

At any rate, if he did have a fountain for Fresca, that would eliminate the need to have a button to order that particular drink to be brought in by staff members from outside the office.

Or it could mean the button was on the fountain; you pushed it, Fresca came out, much as it does at various self-serve places these days. (Well, Fresca is rarely one of the choices, but you know what I mean.) You can tell I've been eating at too many rest area restaurants. But of course Estonut is so sure that's not what the question said/meant.

I had never read/heard about that private soda fountain to my knowledge, but it somehow sounds "more LBJ" than him having a signalling device for a valet to come in bearing a particular drink.

President Johnson had control boxes installed in his White House offices. Typically, the control boxes were equipped with two buzzers to page his secretary and Chief of Staff, and
two buttons to page the military valet who was stationed in a small office next to the Oval Office. The valet would bring him either a Fresca soft drink or coffee, depending on which button the President pushed.

[ghostjmf]

I had to really hunt for the article link after you used the phrase "the above article" in your article. 'Cause I didn't see any "above article". Turns out there is no above article, but there is a link to one, but the link is not a url, but rather the 2 words in blue in thguy65's article. Good thing I'm not color blind.

[Fresca]

Who's up for a letter-writing campaign challenging the MDQ? =P

(Tragically, however, I'm sure that whether it was a button, a switch, or a tap, Yoo Hoo remains the wrong answer.)

[Fresca]

P.S. Love that you went to the Oval Office desk to check that out. Just brilliant.

[TheConfessor]

I also went to the LBJ Presidential Library this afternoon, around 2:30. They were supposed to have cake and refreshments all day for LBJ's 101st birthday, but by the time I got there it was gone. I asked if they had served Fresca, and they said no, only water and coffee. Reports on the cake were that it was a delicious lemon cake. There were two elderly docent ladies at the reception desk. One said that I was the second person today who came in asking about Fresca. The second said, "Fresca? I haven't heard that word in many years. What does it mean? It sounds like something from the 1930s." So the first lady explained that there had been some kind of game show on TV that mentioned LBJ and Fresca, and that someone else had come in on Tuesday and asked about Fresca. These people didn't seem to be real well informed, and I never did see anyone who appeared to be an actual guide, who might be able to answer questions.

When I reached the fourth floor where the refreshments had been, I got there in time to see the cardboard box that had held the cake, in a plastic garbage can in the middle of the room. So I got a photo of that. I then proceeded to the tenth floor, where the replica of the Oval Office is. I saw pretty much the same thing that Frogman reported. There were various buttons for controlling multiple televisions and for summoning staff, but nothing that appeared to be used for ordering coffee, tea, Coke or Fresca. However, they don't claim that the room is an exact replica. It is scaled at 7/8 of the original size, and furnished as closely as possible to the way it was at the White House in the 1960s. I expected to see a few guides who could be asked about specific details, but never found any.

My impression is that the button system was just a way of signaling the staff to bring the requested beverage. I don't think there was any actual soft drink fountain installed in the Oval Office, as some here have inferred. I was wondering how the signal worked, since there might be occasions when the requested order might consist of varying quantities of different combinations of drinks. LBJ's daughters are still around, so maybe they remember how it worked.

I was hoping to find an expert there who would know whether LBJ ever met the Beatles, but there really didn't seem to be anyone around who could answer a question like that.

[vettech]

How disappointing that "refreshments" didn't include Fresca.

[andyrinny]

Nice legwork, frogman and Ed.

Could someone sum up the research? Is the only source for the notion of a Fresca button a book by Doris Kearns Goodwin - presumably "Lyndon Johnson and the American Dream"? Has anyone here looked at that book and seen the mention of the Fresca button?

Also, before Ken's hotseat run, did any websites mention the Fresca button?

Aside from the button, did any websites or other sources mention LBJ's love for Fresca?

[TheConfessor]

Aside from the button, did any websites or other sources mention LBJ's love for Fresca?

Yes, many. It has been a well documented factoid for years. I posted it on this board a year ago.

[Fresca]

I very briefly Googled about the beverage buttons after my show taped and before it aired, and there was some stuff out there (likely readily findable by Googling PAF, I might add, if that were available to me at the time). But not nearly as ubiquitous as that trivia tidbit has become in the last few days.

[drew scheeler]

Several years ago, while watching the History Channel (I'd swear that it was on an episode of Modern Marvels about soda/pop) I remember that one of the cards they show before a commercial said something along the lines of "Lyndon B Johnson was the first president to installed a soda machine at the White House to serve Fresca, his favorite drink."

The question was obviously going for Fresca, but the TOM was fairly flawed.

[andyrinny]

Aside from the button, did any websites or other sources mention LBJ's love for Fresca?

Yes, many. It has been a well documented factoid for years. I posted it on this board a year ago.

I just looked up that thread. So I see two lessons: It pays to read this Bored. And the local news apparently does get some things right (in Austin, if not in Atlanta).

[andyrinny]

I found two articles about the button, which come close to the facts as described on BAM:

1/31/69 Time magazine article on LBJ's departure from the Presidency:

Actually, Johnson's farewell to power has been better cushioned than that of any President preceding him. . . . His teak-paneled office in Austin is the same one he used as President, with phones wherever convenient and a button marked "Galley" to summon a Fresca or a milk shake.
http://www.time.com/time/magazine/artic ... 60,00.html

2/14/08 blog about Presidential trivia:

Lyndon B. Johnson's Fresca Tap - Shortly after he became President, LBJ gave up drinking alcohol, and replaced it with another vice - the refreshing citrus sparkle of Fresca. Which I totally understand, as it's very delicious.
Adjacent to the Oval Office is a small private lounge where the President can go to take a break, catch a quick nap, or even just hide to freak out the Secret Service guys. Originally designed for the Eisenhower administration, it's outfitted with a couple of comfy chairs, some TVs, and direct phones to all the most important aides. LBJ liked it for more informal, one-on-one meetings, and to make it feel more like home, he had a "Fresca" button installed right next to the "Coffee" button, so he could get a glass of his favorite soda whenever he wanted.
http://historyisfunny.blogspot.com/2008 ... house.html