I'll believe its a crisis when peoples start acting

[mrkelley23]

I'm familiar with Ehrlich's name, but I haven't read any of his stuff. I believe he was involved in the beginnings of the ZPG movement, IIRC. I certainly wouldn't be foolish enough to take the bet he did in your story. At least, I would hope not.

I take your point. In fact, my despair over that very point is why I'm not out there beating a drum about it, but instead living my life in kind of a quiet desperation. Here's what I would say to you, in an attempt to convince you:

If the population continues to grow, will you concede that at some point in the future the Earth and its resources will be used up? What is your estimate of when that fill up time will be? I have a few thoughts on that date. The Earth's population continues to grow, at a relatively alarming rate. Although the RATE of growth has been generally trending downward for the last 50 years, the fact remains that the global population is still increasing every year by a little more than 1%. US population has tracked lower than global population for most of the last 5 decades, but it still is growing at a little over 0.9%. Those numbers do not sound alarming, do they? But let's say that the global population continues to grow at around 1%. That means the population will double about every 70 years.

Right now, humans occupy about 3% of the "liveable" land areas of the Earth. After 5 doublings, we will be at 100% occupancy. Of course, we might find a way to populate the oceans, or the other planets in the Solar System, or fairy universes behind the green door. But even if we do, we probably only last for one or two more doublings, if we continue to grow exponentially. So the population time ceiling is in the range of hundreds of years. To argue otherwise is to enter the realm of science fiction, which I'm not willing to do when it comes to our descendants' lives.

Now consider petroleum. Can we all agree that it is a limited resource, and once we've used it all, barring waiting another hundred million years or so, there ain't gonna be no more? Same with coal. Granted there are other potential energy sources, as per my discussion with BiT, but the engineering problems haven't been solved yet. Oil consumption is growing globally at a pretty constant rate of 7% per year. That means oil consumption doubles every ten years (much like US prison populations). Unfortunately, there is no way production can keep up with that rate of consumption. The only time since the late 19th century that oil consumption hasn't risen at 7% per year was during the oil embargo of the mid 1970s. That at least gives me hope that market forces might help, but I think China and India are going to have far more to say about it than the US.

If anyone can find me compelling information that there's enough petroleum anywhere on or in the Earth to withstand 10 doublings of global consumption, I'll shut up. But I don't think you can. And if we continue at current rates (and yes, I realize that's a big if) then I think 100 years may be TOO optimistic. And as much as I haven't liked some of the things President Obama has done since taking office, he has at least engaged in a credible effort to get the public talking about energy consumption, alternative fuels, and fuel efficiencies. I think President Bush realized this also, especially in his second term, but he was so busy punching ghosts that he didn't pay as much attention to it as he could have. He would have had much more pull, as a former oilman (regardless of his lack of success in that field) to get the message across to those who need to hear it most.

This is why I keep engaging TMITSSS in his thread about global warming/climate change. It infuriates me that the people who are actually talking about this subject are among the biggest hypocrites in the history of the Earth. I'm no saint, but I drive an energy-efficient car, I try to conserve energy in my home (more out of my innate cheapness than any altruistic motive, but oh well) and I talk to young people about energy consumption and what their future could be like. I don't share my crazier or more apocalyptic visions with them -- at least, not yet.

[themanintheseersuckersuit]

This time The BBC

[themanintheseersuckersuit]

Now WWF Ambassador Tom Brady

[themanintheseersuckersuit]

Where's Al Gore Now

July 22, 2010--San Diego
June 28, 2010--San Diego
April 30, 2010--Philippines
April 27, 2010--New York (afternoon)
April 27, 2010--Chicago (morning)
April 24, 2010--Italy
April 22, 2010--Montreal
April 8, 2010--North Carolina
March 27, 2010--Nevada
March 26, 2010--Brazil
March 4, 2010--Oslo
February 27, 2010--Phoenix
February 25, 2010--Cupertino
February 22, 2010--Las Vegas
January 27, 2010--San Francisco
January 16, 2010--Boston
January 14, 2010--New York

[mrkelley23]

But I bet he painted his private jet green.

[wintergreen48]

But I bet he painted his private jet green.

Using recycled non-toxic paint.

One gallon of which was probably flown in from Azerbaijian as a special order.

[themanintheseersuckersuit]

Twofer

Al Gore buys oceanfront property

Former Vice President Al Gore and his wife, Tipper, have added a Montecito-area property to their real estate holdings, reports the Montecito Journal.

The couple spent $8,875,000 on an ocean-view villa on 1.5 acres with a swimming pool, spa and fountains, a real estate source familiar with the deal confirms. The Italian-style house has six fireplaces, five bedrooms and nine bathrooms.

http://www.latimes.com/features/home/la ... 3538.story

Harrison Ford on his airplane use.

Ford said, “They’re quite right. I’ll start walking everywhere when they start walking everywhere.”

Ford is the vice chairman of Conservation International and has done an advertisement for the environmentalist group Team Earth. In commenting on his seven planes, Ford told CNSNews.com: “I only fly one of them at a time--and general aviation, although it does, use of carbon fuels does contribute to greenhouse gas emissions.”

http://www.cnsnews.com/news/article/64907

[silvercamaro]

Here's the last paragraph of the story linked by TMITSSS: "Ford has piloted a helicopter on rescue missions near his Wyoming home, on one occasion rescuing a Boy Scout and on another a stranded hiker."

This is true, not Hollywood hype. His home is near Jackson, Wyoming. He also has assisted to help avoid potential tragedies in less dramatic ways, but he has not sought publicity for his efforts.

In my opinion, this makes Harrison Ford a far superior "Citizen of the World."

[themanintheseersuckersuit]

Here's the last paragraph of the story linked by TMITSSS: "Ford has piloted a helicopter on rescue missions near his Wyoming home, on one occasion rescuing a Boy Scout and on another a stranded hiker."

This is true, not Hollywood hype. His home is near Jackson, Wyoming. He also has assisted to help avoid potential tragedies in less dramatic ways, but he has not sought publicity for his efforts.

In my opinion, this makes Harrison Ford a far superior "Citizen of the World."

Let me state that I am in favor having helicopters and enough energy run them to rescue Boy Scouts and stranded hikers. I even favor beach front mansions.

[themanintheseersuckersuit]

Ashley Judd


Judd said, “Well, it’s a very big question, and one that far exceeds the scope of this little red carpet interview. I am on the board of Defenders of Wildlife, with whom I’m very happy to serve. And I had to the chance to testify before a House subcommittee on the cap and trade legislation, and specifically designating 5 percent of the revenue generated by cap and trade to help ameliorate and offset the damage global climate change is doing to different environmental systems. So, it’s a really big deal to me.”

“I try to practice on a daily basis, leaving a small carbon footprint, whether it’s as simple as carpooling and not flying when that’s, you know, taking direct flights instead of -- all that kind of stuff,” said Judd. “There’s just a lot that individuals can do. And I think it’s important we all try to make a difference.”

Ashley Judd has appeared in several ads for the group Defenders of Wildlife.

What’s parking got to do with Ashley and Dario, you ask? Well, I’ll tell you. Parking isn’t a problem when you’ve got miles of land in TN. But according to the article, parking is relatively limited in the UK. Which is a problem when you’ve got a fleet of Ferraris and Porsches and motorcyles on both continents, as Ashley and Dario do. And seeing as how they have their own CASTLE in Scotland (on which they spent roughly six million dollars) and castles aren’t known for their garages, they decided to install a stacking parking system with room for about 20 cars in their home, otherwise known as Rednock Castle in Perthshire. Computer sensors allow him to store cars just inches apart. Isnt that handy? Happily, they seem to have plenty of room to store their helicopters as well. Thank goodness!

A licensed pilot for more than six years, Franchitti is looking into buying a jet so he can spend as many Sunday nights in Nashville after races as possible.

[themanintheseersuckersuit]

Finally a data point where someone is acting like it is a crisis.

Dear environmentally aware citizen of the world! http://www.nationalttestcenter.dk

Copenhagen, December 2009

The Danish government plans to clear forests and destroy unique nature for the benefit of industry.

The Danish environment minister Troels Lund Poulsen decided, on behalf of the government, on 30th September 2009, that the clearing of 15 km2 of forest in the north west of Denmark will take place. A test centre for the development of offshore windmills is planned to take up 30 km2 of land in the Thy region, near Østerild. This deforestation will create an increase of 400,000 tonnes of CO2 emission, the equivalent of the CO2 emission of 100,000 people per year.

The government will force the local population out of their homes. The reasoning behind this is said to be for the benefit of the Danish windmill industry, which will in turn create more Danish jobs. The regulations to finalise the evictions goes against Denmark’s constitution and is therefore clearly illegal.

In current plans, the area is categorised as a recreational area, where the set up of windmills is prohibited.

The region is one of Denmark’s most beautiful areas. With its rugged landscapes and grand views, as well as many rare species of animals, birds and plants, the area is representative of authentic Danish nature. There are very few areas of Denmark left, where one can experience darkness at night and complete silence.

The windmills, which are 250 meters tall, are planned to be along a 6 km linear south/north stretch. This will prevent birds in the international Ramsar-area, Vejlerne, which is situated to the east of the test centre, from flying west to the EU-habitat area Vullum Sø and to Thy National Park just south of Hanstholm.

The Danish government has not consulted properly about the plans. The Danish citizens had little time to put forward comments of the project. The hearing has only been 11 days long, with 9 of those being a national holiday.

http://www.nationalttestcenter.dk/nyheder/english


I refrained from ragging on Jeremy Irons and his 7 houses

[Vague Mini]

I've avoided clicking on this thread for the whole time it's been up, and I just read enough to see tmitsss has been confusing politicians and celebrities with people. "There's your problem right there!" -Mythbusters

[themanintheseersuckersuit]

CASH-CONSCIOUS David Cameron flew out to meet President Barack Obama last night on a regular BA flight - astonishing other passengers. For the first time on a major official visit, the Premier turned down chartering his own plane to make the two-day trip to Washington DtC And he even spurned First Class tickets to travel in the far cheaper Business Class. The move saved £200,000 in costs, Downing CAStreet officials said. Passengers were aghast when Mr Cameron and his team of officials boarded the plane to Dulles airport and took seats beside them In the past, PMs travelling on long overseas trips have always chartered a Boeing 747 or 767 - at a cost of £300,000 - or used RAF jets. £300,000 - or used RAF jets.

[MarleysGh0st]

Passengers were aghast when Mr Cameron and his team of officials boarded the plane to Dulles airport and took seats beside them.

They were aghast? Are politicians that despised in the UK?

[minimetoo26]

Passengers were aghast when Mr Cameron and his team of officials boarded the plane to Dulles airport and took seats beside them.

They were aghast? Are politicians that despised in the UK?

I'd be aghast if I thought someone would be campaigning for my vote for the duration of a trans-Atlantic flight myself...

[Thousandaire]

Premier? Who wrote that article?

[themanintheseersuckersuit]

Oprah Taking Audience Down Under, with Travolta at Controls
Oprah kicks off season 25 with a surprise trip for audience members.
By ALLY CLARK
Updated 12:58 PM CDT, Mon, Sep 13, 2010

Oprah Winfrey kicked off her farewell Season in true Oprah fashion by surprising her audience with a big gift: She will be taking all 300 audience members on a trip down under to Australia.


Source: http://www.nbcchicago.com/news/local-be ... z0zR5Oj3jU

[etaoin22]

CASH-CONSCIOUS David Cameron flew out to meet President Barack Obama last night on a regular BA flight - astonishing other passengers. For the first time on a major official visit, the Premier turned down chartering his own plane to make the two-day trip to Washington DtC And he even spurned First Class tickets to travel in the far cheaper Business Class. The move saved £200,000 in costs, Downing CAStreet officials said. Passengers were aghast when Mr Cameron and his team of officials boarded the plane to Dulles airport and took seats beside them In the past, PMs travelling on long overseas trips have always chartered a Boeing 747 or 767 - at a cost of £300,000 - or used RAF jets. £300,000 - or used RAF jets.

dipping into this thread for the first time in a few months....

A head of government of a major power involved in war should not be on a commercial aircraft. He put everyone else's life on that aircraft at a small but real increased risk, given that that plane is on a timetable and does not have the capacity for missile countermeasures, among other reasons.

Want to save money, convert back a beautiful old VC-10 from RAF tanker duty until expected aircraft retirement date of 2015.

[themanintheseersuckersuit]

[Thousandaire]

German engineer finds way around incandescent ban

[silvercamaro]

German engineer finds way around incandescent ban

I love this!

[Beebs52]

The cockles of my wherever-the-cockles-live part of my body are vibrating with glee with this news. We're sort of stocking up on the heatballs already. Must continue. Must continue.

OH. But, first let's all watch the interview with Prince Charles, whose carbon footprint, I'm sure, is exemplary.

[themanintheseersuckersuit]

"Customs officers seized at the airport in Cologne, 40,000 bulbs, which he purchased in China Rotthäuser entrepreneur Siegfried and his brother ... Rotthäuser the entrepreneur has held round the idea of Brussels to ban incandescent bulbs, which it considers absurd. Therefore, those imported from China, officially described as a small radiator. These are offered as an action of art called "heat ball". sell them for several thousand people have a huge interest in classic bulbs. "

http://translate.google.com/translate?u ... 1&ie=UTF-8

[themanintheseersuckersuit]

10 Restaurants Worth a Plane Ride http://travel.nytimes.com/2011/01/09/tr ... rants.html

A yacht to smile about: Billionaire Google founder buys 193-foot boat for $45million ... but he bought it second-hand http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... -hand.html

Both the NYT and Google have hectored us about Global Warming.

[Jeemie]

I always love the "since the guys telling us about global warming are hypocrites, global warming doesn't exist" fallacy.

And you do it so well, seersucker!!!

Of course, I'm more worried about the resources angle mrk spoke of myself. I bet his apocalyptic visions don't hold a candle to mine!