Possible October surprise?

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danielh41 · #1 Post by **danielh41** » Fri Oct 03, 2008 8:21 am

I came across this today. It's not in any of the mainstream press, so I don't know how accurate the story is in relation to the lawsuit going on now. The author doesn't seem to write that well (what does "signed a breathe of relief" mean?). But here it is: http://www.newswithviews.com/Ryter/jon252.htm

JUDGE ORDERS OBAMA TO PRODUCE BIRTH CERTIFICATE

By Jon Christian Dryer

October 3, 2008

NewsWithViews.com

On September 29, 2008 US District Court Judge R. Barclay Surrick, the federal magistrate for the Eastern District of Pennsylvania ruled in the matter of Philip J. Berg vs Barack Hussein Obama, et al as the world was distracted by the $700 billion subprime mortgage crisis. Obama signed a breathe of relief as the mainstream media chose to ignore the question: "Can Senator Barack Hussein Obama legally seek the office of President of the United States?"

The flap began in June when National Review's Jim Geraghty raised the question and asked the Obama Campaign to release a copy of his birth certificate in order to prove that he actually was born in the United States. (Reports had previously surfaced claiming that Obama's Kenyan grandmother, Sarah Hussein Obama, told reporters that Obama was not born in Hawaii, but in Kenya. She reportedly told reporters that when her son, Barack Hussein Obama, Sr. returned to Kenya he was accompanied by a pregnant white wife who was close to term.)

Obama's family did not take to Stanley Ann Dunham Obama well according to Sarah Obama because she was white. Shortly after she arrived in Kenya Stanley Ann decided to return to Hawaii because she did not like how Muslim men treated their wives in Kenya. However, because she was near term the airline would not let her fly until after the birth of her baby. Obama's grandmother said the baby was born in Kenya and that shortly after Barack Hussein Obama, Jr. was born, Stanley Ann returned to Hawaii.

Purportedly, when she arrived back in Hawaii, Stanley Anne registered her son's live birth as an event which had just happened—in Hawaii. This supposition is based on the appearance, shortly after Nov. 6, 2007, of a Hawaiian birth certificate that was issued, as a duplicate birth certificate, by the State of Hawaii to a US Senator who requested it.

While the Internet screamed that the birth certificate, which appeared on the Obama Campaign's "Fight The Smears" website and was also downloaded and used by far left blogger Markos Zuniga on his website, Daily Kos, it was not an electronic image concocted by Daily KOs as was hypothesized by a self-described cyvbersleuth who uses the cyber pseudonym Techdude. It was the real McCoy—even if it was issued as a political favor to a prospective Democratic presidential candidate by a Democrat official in Hawaii. The county clerk who issued the document, which purports to be a copy of an original document, was date stamped "Nov. 6, 2007" on the reverse side of the birth certificate in blue ink which bled through and is visible on the front of the electronic image.

Attorney Philip J. Berg, the former head of the Montgomery County. Pennsylvania Democratic Party and a former member of the Democratic State Convention and, reportedly a Hillary Clinton supporter, wanted to learn the truth from the myriad of rumors that also suggested that Sen. Obama may also have been a citizen of Indonesia. The only consistent part of the story was Stanley Ann returning to Hawaii to claim he had been in the United States and was a US citizen. In his ruling, Judge Surrick noted that the "...cause came before the United States District Court Judge, Honorable R. Barclay Surrick on defendant Barack Hussein Obama and the Democratic National Committee's motion to dismiss." The order continued, "Having reviewed the motion and plaintiff's opposition to said motion and for good cause shown, it is hereby ordered that the motion to dismiss pursuant to F.R.C.P. 12(b)(1) and 12(b)(6) is denied. It is further order of this court that the following discovery is to be turned over to plaintiff within three (3) days.

1. Obama's "vault" version (certified copy of his "original" long version) birth certificate; and
2. a certified copy of Obama's Certificate of Citizenship;
3. a certified copy of Obama's oath of allegiance."

In his original filing, Berg specifically asked for those three items. Berg told the court that "...at the time Plaintiff's complaint was filed, Plaintiff was requesting protections from the court in order to stop Obama from being nominated by the DNC as the Democratic Presidential Nominee as Obama is not eligible to serve as President of the United States. However, Obama was nominated by the DNC...For that reason, Plaintiff must amend his complaint and will be amending this complaint to file a First Amendment complaint...."

Berg argued that he felt it was the role of the Federal Election Commission to ensure that presidential and congressional candidates are eligible to hold the positions for which they were seeking, and that those candidates run a fair and legitimate campaign. "In vetting the presidential candidate," Berg argued, "the DNC and the FEC are required to ensure the eligibility requirements pursuant to our Constitution are met and the Presidential nominee, if elected, is qualified and eligible to serve pursuant to our United States Constitution. In order to be eligible to run for the Office of President of the United States, you must be a "natural born" citizen.

"There appears to be no question that Defendant Obama's mother, Stanley Ann Dunham, was a US citizen. It is also undisputed, however, that his father, Barack Obama, Sr., was a citizen of Kenya. Obama's parents, according to divorce recorded, were married on or about February 2, 1961.

"Defendant Obama claims he was born in Honolulu, Hawaii. on August 4, 1961 and it is uncertain in which hospital he claims to have been born. Obama's grandmother on his father's side, his half-brother and half-sister all claim Obama was born not in Hawaii but in Kenya. reports reflect that Obama's mother traveled to Kenya during her pregnancy; however, she was prevented from boarding a flight from Kenya to Hawaii. at her late stage of pregnancy (which apparently are normal restrictions, to avoid births during flights). By these reports, Stanley Ann Dunham Obama gave birth to Obama in Kenya, after which she flew home and registered Obama's birth. There are records of a "registry of birth" for Obama, on or about August 8, 1961 in the public records office in Hawaii."

Berg's investigators revealed that Obama's own half-sister Maya Soetoro—with whom he was raised—seemed not to know where her own brother was born. In the Nov., 2004 interview by the Rainbow Newsletter Maya Soetoro said Obama was born on Aug. 4, 1961 at Queens Medical Center in Honolulu, Hawaii. In February, 2008 Maya was interviewed by the Star Bulletin. This time she told reporters that Obama was born on August 4, 1961 at the Kaliolani Medical Center for Women and Children. On June 9, 2008 Wayne Madsen, a journalist with Online Journal published an article in which he said a research team went to Mombassa, Kenya and located a Certificate registering the live birth of Barack Hussein Obama, Jr. to his father, a Kenyan citizen and his mother, a US citizen.

Berg's argument to the court was that under the US Nationality Act of 1940, Section 317 (b), a minor child follows the naturalization and citizenship status of his or her custodial parent. In Obama's case, Berg argued, a minor child follows the naturalization and citizenship status of his or her custodial father. Obama's Indonesian stepfather, Lolo Soetora signed a statement acknowledging Obama as his son, giving Obama natural Indonesian citizenship, which explains the name "Barry Soetoro" and his citizenship listed as Indonesian. Loss of US citizenship, under US law in effect in 1967 required that foreign citizenship be achieved through "application." Which, according to Berg, is precisely what happened to Obama when his mother married Soetoro and the family moved to Indonesia.

When Obama and his mother moved to Indonesia, Obama had already been enrolled in school—something that could not have happened under Indonesian law if Soetoro had not signed an acknowledgment (the application) affirming that Obama was his son, it deemed his son to an Indonesian State citizen. (Citizenship of Republic of Indonesia, Law No. 9 of 1992 dated 31 mar. 1992, Indonesia Civil Code): "...State children of Indonesia include: (viii) children who are born outside of legal marriage from foreign State citizen mother who are acknowledged by father who is Indonesian State citizen as his children and that acknowledgment is made prior to children reaching 18 years of age or prior to marriage; Republic of Indonesia Constitution, 1945." Furthermore, under Indonesian law, if a resident Indonesian citizen married a foreigner—in this case, Lolo Soetoro marrying Stanley Ann Obama—she was required to renounce her US citizenship.

In his lawsuit, Berg demanded a copy of Obama's Certificate of Citizenship, a document Obama must have applied for to regain his citizenship—which was lost in Indonesia. He will have that document only if the proper paperwork was filed with the US State Department when Obama returned to Hawaii in 1971 since that is the only way Obama could regain his US "natural born" status. Berg is convinced that Obama was never naturalized in the United States after his return. Obama returned to his maternal grandparents in Hawaii without his mother. Since she is the only one who could have filed for the reinstatement of his citizenship, it is unlikely it ever happened. If it did, his Certificate of Citizenship would affirm his right to seek the office of President. Without it, Barack Obama is just another resident alien who can't legally hold his seat in the US Senate.

© 2008 Jon C. Ryter - All Rights Reserved

ne1410s · #2 Post by **ne1410s** » Fri Oct 03, 2008 8:30 am

My goodness. This is like a bad Oliver Stone movie. Wait, that's redundant.

JBillyGirl · #3 Post by **JBillyGirl** » Fri Oct 03, 2008 8:37 am

I don't buy it.

Neither does Factcheck.org:

http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008 ... e_usa.html

Neither does Snopes:

http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/bi ... ficate.asp

IMHO, case closed.

minimetoo26 · #4 Post by **minimetoo26** » Fri Oct 03, 2008 8:40 am

You can find just about anything if you dig deeply enough into the bowels of the internet.

But it's icky and creepy. I won't do it. I could get muck on my tin-foil hat.

nitrah55 · #5 Post by **nitrah55** » Fri Oct 03, 2008 8:41 am

I'm sorry, were you looking for this?

http://i305.photobucket.com/albums/nn22 ... ficate.jpg

danielh41 · #6 Post by **danielh41** » Fri Oct 03, 2008 8:57 am

I'm not making any comment on the allegations other than to say they are far-fetched. But what I can't come up with (other than this poorly written article) is whether the judge in this case really did dismiss the Obama campaign's motion for dismissal and whether the court really did order Obama to produce the documents that the plantiff requested. If so, then a judge somewhere is taking the allegations seriously.

And the document that nitrah linked to looks rather plain to be an official birth certificate. I know that my Arkansas birth certificate lists the hospital name, my birth length and weight, whether I was a single birth or part of multiples, and my parent's address. None of that is on the birth certificate image from Hawaii.

I'm just saying that if anything at all comes of the court case, it could be a mess for Obama and the Democratic Party. On the other hand, if it's dismissed, then no harm done--just another crackpot conspiracy theorist.

Gimme A Squiggly · #7 Post by **Gimme A Squiggly** » Fri Oct 03, 2008 8:59 am

The only October surprise will be if we don't run out of the good candy again before Halloween....

BackInTex · #8 Post by **BackInTex** » Fri Oct 03, 2008 9:12 am

nitrah55 wrote:I'm sorry, were you looking for this?

http://i305.photobucket.com/albums/nn22 ... ficate.jpg

Like I believe that!

I lightly rubbed my screen and felt no embossed seal which is required to make it official and acceptable.

minimetoo26 · #9 Post by **minimetoo26** » Fri Oct 03, 2008 9:12 am

Gimme A Squiggly wrote:The only October surprise will be if we don't run out of the good candy again before Halloween....

I think you can get White Rabbit at a deep discount these days....

nitrah55 · #10 Post by **nitrah55** » Fri Oct 03, 2008 9:15 am

danielh41 wrote:And the document that nitrah linked to looks rather plain to be an official birth certificate. I know that my Arkansas birth certificate lists the hospital name, my birth length and weight, whether I was a single birth or part of multiples, and my parent's address. None of that is on the birth certificate image from Hawaii.

And all anyone would have to do to check would be to order someone else's birth certificate from Hawaii and see if the format's the same, wouldn't they?

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter ... e-part-ii/

From the article: "The Hawaii Department of Health receives about a dozen e-mail inquiries a day about Obama’s birth certificate, spokesman Okubo said.

“'I guess the big issue that’s being raised is the lack of an embossed seal and a signature,” Okubo said, pointing out that in Hawaii, both those things are on the back of the document. 'Because they scanned the front … you wouldn’t see those things.'

"Okubo says she got a copy of her own birth certificate last year and it is identical to the Obama one we received."

Daniel, if you're really trying to help McCain, or hobble Obama, you could do a lot better than copying poorly-written accounts of what you call "crackpot conspiracy theorists," and then covering it with "well, I don't know, but I'm just sayin.'" That's not politics, that's gossip.

#11 Post by **littlebeast13** » Fri Oct 03, 2008 9:17 am

minimetoo26 wrote:
Gimme A Squiggly wrote:The only October surprise will be if we don't run out of the good candy again before Halloween....
I think you can get White Rabbit at a deep discount these days....

As long as it isn't those nasty orange and black wrapped snotballs.....

lb13

BackInTex · #12 Post by **BackInTex** » Fri Oct 03, 2008 9:17 am

nitrah55 wrote: Daniel, if you're really trying to help McCain, or hobble Obama, you could do a lot better than copying poorly-written accounts of what you call "crackpot conspiracy theorists," and then covering it with "well, I don't know, but I'm just sayin.'" That's not politics, that's gossip.

Actually, I think the bored term would be conJuchure.

nitrah55 · #13 Post by **nitrah55** » Fri Oct 03, 2008 9:20 am

BackInTex wrote:
nitrah55 wrote: Daniel, if you're really trying to help McCain, or hobble Obama, you could do a lot better than copying poorly-written accounts of what you call "crackpot conspiracy theorists," and then covering it with "well, I don't know, but I'm just sayin.'" That's not politics, that's gossip.
Actually, I think the bored term would be conJuchure.

I love it when BiT tops me.

BackInTex · #14 Post by **BackInTex** » Fri Oct 03, 2008 9:26 am

nitrah55 wrote: I love it when BiT tops me.

Now if only I can get Pea to say that!

nitrah55 · #15 Post by **nitrah55** » Fri Oct 03, 2008 9:29 am

BackInTex wrote:
nitrah55 wrote: I love it when BiT tops me.
Now if only I can get Pea to say that!

I heard her say something like that.

I don't like to brag, but....

mellytu74 · #16 Post by **mellytu74** » Fri Oct 03, 2008 9:59 am

daniel --

It certainly HAS been in the mainstream press.

Maybe, of course, that's because 1) Berg is from the Philadelphia suburbs and 2) we are a battleground state.

Either way, it is old news here.

Berg is a local, um, character.

He sued the Bush Administration for complicity in the 9/11 attacks, he filed suit to disbar three Supreme Court justices after the Bush-Gore decision in 2000.

And those are just the two suits I can think of off the top of my head. I know there are more.

As far as I know, the motion to file was denied in August because Berg has no sworn affidavits to support his case.

I didn't even realize it was still alive. I suspect, in the end, it will be dismissed.

Similar to the dismissal of the suit against McCain this summer, the one that claimed that he is not eligible for the Presidency because he was born in the Panama Canal zone, father's military service notwithstanding.

danielh41 · #17 Post by **danielh41** » Fri Oct 03, 2008 10:02 am

mellytu74 wrote:daniel --

It certainly HAS been in the mainstream press.

Maybe, of course, that's because 1) Berg is from the Philadelphia suburbs and 2) we are a battleground state.

Either way, it is old news here.

Berg is a local, um, character.

He sued the Bush Administration for complicity in the 9/11 attacks, he filed suit to disbar three Supreme Court justices after the Bush-Gore decision in 2000.

And those are just the two suits I can think of off the top of my head. I know there are more.

As far as I know, the motion to file was denied in August because Berg has no sworn affidavits to support his case.

I didn't even realize it was still alive. I suspect, in the end, it will be dismissed.

Similar to the dismissal of the suit against McCain this summer, the one that claimed that he is not eligible for the Presidency because he was born in the Panama Canal zone, father's military service notwithstanding.

Thanks Melly. That's the sort of info I was looking for when I posted this.

BackInTex · #18 Post by **BackInTex** » Fri Oct 03, 2008 10:07 am

mellytu74 wrote:daniel --

It certainly HAS been in the mainstream press.

Maybe, of course, that's because 1) Berg is from the Philadelphia suburbs and 2) we are a battleground state.

Either way, it is old news here.

Berg is a local, um, character.

He sued the Bush Administration for complicity in the 9/11 attacks, he filed suit to disbar three Supreme Court justices after the Bush-Gore decision in 2000.

And those are just the two suits I can think of off the top of my head. I know there are more.

As far as I know, the motion to file was denied in August because Berg has no sworn affidavits to support his case.

I didn't even realize it was still alive. I suspect, in the end, it will be dismissed.

Similar to the dismissal of the suit against McCain this summer, the one that claimed that he is not eligible for the Presidency because he was born in the Panama Canal zone, father's military service notwithstanding.

This guy needs to find a hobby.

Oh wait, I guess this is his hobby.

Jeemie · #19 Post by **Jeemie** » Fri Oct 03, 2008 11:25 am

minimetoo26 wrote:
Gimme A Squiggly wrote:The only October surprise will be if we don't run out of the good candy again before Halloween....
I think you can get White Rabbit at a deep discount these days....

Someone always thinks of the best jokes before I do.

themanintheseersuckersuit · #20 Post by **themanintheseersuckersuit** » Fri Oct 03, 2008 5:46 pm

Stupid plus lawyers is hardly surprising.

dodgersteve182 · #21 Post by **dodgersteve182** » Sat Oct 04, 2008 11:10 am

My October Surpirse is that I got confirmation last week for my VIP Admission into the much heralded Baron's Investment Conference in NYC on October 24! Always a great event of insiders and individual investors alike!

peacock2121 · #22 Post by **peacock2121** » Sat Oct 04, 2008 1:45 pm

BackInTex wrote:
nitrah55 wrote: Daniel, if you're really trying to help McCain, or hobble Obama, you could do a lot better than copying poorly-written accounts of what you call "crackpot conspiracy theorists," and then covering it with "well, I don't know, but I'm just sayin.'" That's not politics, that's gossip.
Actually, I think the bored term would be conJuchure.

This made me glad I clicked on this thread, even though I refused to read any post written by daniel.

peacock2121 · #23 Post by **peacock2121** » Sat Oct 04, 2008 1:46 pm

BackInTex wrote:
nitrah55 wrote: I love it when BiT tops me.
Now if only I can get Pea to say that!

Hey!

You talking about me when I'm not around?

peacock2121 · #24 Post by **peacock2121** » Sat Oct 04, 2008 1:47 pm

nitrah55 wrote:
BackInTex wrote:
nitrah55 wrote: I love it when BiT tops me.
Now if only I can get Pea to say that!
I heard her say something like that.

I don't like to brag, but....

You can go ahead and brag.

really

you can

danielh41 · #25 Post by **danielh41** » Sat Oct 04, 2008 5:49 pm

peacock2121 wrote:
BackInTex wrote:
nitrah55 wrote: Daniel, if you're really trying to help McCain, or hobble Obama, you could do a lot better than copying poorly-written accounts of what you call "crackpot conspiracy theorists," and then covering it with "well, I don't know, but I'm just sayin.'" That's not politics, that's gossip.
Actually, I think the bored term would be conJuchure.
This made me glad I clicked on this thread, even though I refused to read any post written by daniel.

You don't like hearing the truth?